Abubakar Shekau #fundie

Abubakar Shekau #fundie bbc.com

Abubakar Shekau, militant leader of Boko Haram in a video about young girls he abducted:

In a video, he states that the girls should not have been in school in the first place, but rather should get married

"God instructed me to sell them, they are his properties and I will carry out his instructions," he said.

38 comments

old comment by Hasan Prishtina

The Koran uses the male gender to include women's obligations. Were that not the case, then women would absolved of all obligations and you would be a common criminal. As it is, people in the Koran are enjoined to gain wisdom and knowledge, e.g. by going to school. So you are preventing these girls from fulfilling their duty as Muslims. So you are not only a common criminal, but an anti-Muslim one to boot.

If they belong to God, it follows that they don't belong to you. That is, unless you are claiming to be God for which the penalty in Islamic law is death. As it is, you are an abductor. I'm sure you understand the penalty for abduction in Islamic law is death.

old comment by Anon-e-moose

I'm all for the Geneva Convention, or the modern-day equivalents.

WWII. The ordinary Wehrmacht & Waffen SS. Just ask my uncle who was amongst the Allied troops who liberated Bergen-Belsen. Some of his comrades beat the shit out of the SS still left there, after what they saw.

Boko Haram. Should the SAS be sent in to deal with them - and to #[URL=https://www.facebook.com/bringbackourgirls]BringBackOurGirls[/URL] - just give me one good fucking reason why said SAS shouldn't do what they fucking well like with you, once they capture you slimebags...?

There's no way anyone could possibly be worse than you. We don't kidnap innocent girls. We don't do what the Lord's Resistance Army did. We're human beings. Humans don't so much as think the way you do, Boko Haram. Certainly we in the UK. Just ask the Muslim Malala Yousufzai here.

'Cowards take hostages. Klingons do not.'

Worf (Michael Dorn), "Star Trek: The Next Generation"

#[URL=https://www.facebook.com/dontbuygirls]RealMenDon't[i]BuyGirls[/URL]

@Doubting Thomas

As per the aforementioned Lord's Resistance Army:

Ideology: Christian Fundamentalism

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=100714&Page=2#1662699

Because I'm suuuuuure you'd agree there's light-years of difference between the two, eh Troll4Life?! As Boko Haram - and therefore ALL Muslims, your words verbatim - are Evil, but the LRA are Christain Fundamentalists, full of the 'God of Unconditional Love's mercy, they don't do what is essentially the same as Boko Haram, and therefore they - along with ALL right-wing Fundamentalist Christains such as you dearie, with No Exceptions - aren't Evil, natch. [/hyper-sarcasm]

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=100652

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/10781259/Attorney-General-Rise-of-fundamentalism-is-damaging-Christianity.html (emphasis added):

'He said that 1,500 years of Christian values are “not going to disappear overnight” and said that many people remain believers even if they choose not to go to Church*.

However, he warned people are being discouraged from openly declaring their beliefs because of the “deep intolerance” of religious extremists of all faiths, including Islam and Christianity.'

And that from the Conservative Party's - and devout Christian - Attorney-General Dominic Grieve. I refer you to the words under the photo of him in that article:

'Dominic Grieve has warned that fundamentalism is turning people away from religion'

Prior to #BringBackOurGirls, Nigeria effectively had a culture of kidnapping & human trafficking. That country is a mainly Christian-governed one. Nothing was done to eliminate that culture, even from people's minds.

Moral: Fundamentalist religion - both Muslim & Christian - is Evil. I refer you to Dominic Grieve's own words, o Troll4Life; he, like yours truly, speaking from the very secular UK.

Atheism is growing in the West. Ratzy the Nazi's whining about Secularism's growth in Europe. The LRA & Boko Haram. You do the maths, Christain fundies.

old comment by Passerby

Does this guy even believe the shit coming out of his own mouth? Do his men?

He kidnapped close to 300 girls for the express purpose of selling them into slavery and now he's pillaging his way across the country raiding small villages, stealing livestock, and kidnapping even more girls as young as 12 while on the run. I'm pretty sure even the most ludicrously heavy-handed interpretation of Islam says that's fucking heinous. The Old Testament doesn't even condone that doing that shit to people who never wronged you (and your own countrymen) and it pretty much glorifies conquest, murder, and rape.

Sick piece of shit. The only thing holy about him is his impending ventilation.

old comment by Nobodyyouknow

I hate to act as the devil's advocate here but it does seem to me that a lot of the posters here do have blinkers on when it comes to Islam, and want to believe that simply because it is not a Western religion any interpretation of Islam which disagrees with the incredibly Western idea of human rights is somehow marginal and inauthentic. Some, like SpukkiKitty push this wishful thinking - there is no other more-or-less respectful term for a belief so at variance with reality - to the point of absurdity claiming that Wahabis 'don't give a damn about Islam'. Any attempt at an.objective reading of history and the Q'aran and Hadith reveals clearly that Wahabiism is infinitely closer to Mohammed's original message that later,, mor eliberal historical versions of Islam, and particulalrly modern moderate and liberal Islam which absorbed virtually all its liberal ideas from Western sources. Mohammed was a deeply evil and violemt man - a murderer, a war-monger, a slaver, and a child rapist, among other things. The Q'aran and Hadith are just as irredeemably vile as the Old Testament.

old comment by Hasan Prishtina

@ Nobodyyouknow

Read my quote again; that's not what I said. I said women's obligations are equal to men, not that they were treated the same. Furthermore, if you were interested in something other than trolling you would have seen that I had referred exclusively to the Koran which says very little on the subject except in a very specific circumstance. If you knew anything worth knowing about Islam, you would know that those rules come from later centuries of jurisprudence. Simply put, your question has no relevance to what I wrote.

Further more, "No True Scotsman" would say that no Scotsman would act in such a way. My post does not say that; it says that Abubakar Shekau, plainly a Muslim, is acting in an anti-Muslim way. It is perfectly possible for someone who believes in a belief system to act contrary to its precepts. That's not "No True Scotsman"; the word for it is hypocrisy. You know the kind of thing I mean; like when an atheist preens himself on only coming to conclusions after accepting "sufficient evidence," yet at the very same time promotes the most risible of historical falsehoods through a miasma of assumptions and fallacies.

old comment by Nobodyyouknow

I hate to act as the devil's advocaat here but it does seem to me that I have blinkers on my fedora, and I want to believe that and anyone which disagrees with we MREs incredibly non-Modernist idea of men's rights is somehow marginal and inauthentic. Some, like me push this wishful thinking - there is no other more-or-less respectful term for a belief so at variance with our 'opinions' - to the point of absurdity claiming that MREs 'venting' can change Reality. Any attempt at a subjective reading of history and this thread reveals clearly that MREism is infinitely closer to Mohammed's original message, mor (sic) enazi historical versions of Islam, and particulalrly (sic) modern moderate and liberal Islam which absorbed virtually all its liberal ideas from Western sources. MREs are deeply evil and violemt (sic) men - murderers, war-mongers, slavers, and child rapists, among other things. We MREs are just as irredeemably vile as Boko Haram and the Taliban.

old comment by Elie

@Nobodyyouknow

There are passages in the Koran that are positively heinous, as even a cursory reading of it will tell you, just as with the Bible.

However many moderate Muslims regard those passages with the same contempt that any Christians who aren't batshit insane reserve for Leviticus.

The problem with criminals like Shekau here is that they get far, far more screen time than any reasonable Muslims. I'm not saying that Islam is any more respectful of human rights and dignity that Christianity, and it is actually much worse in some areas, but there is definitely a reformative movement. It is, however, heavily shackled by the fundamentalist community.

old comment by Nobodyyouknow

@Elie:

It seems that I may have been misunderstood. I am not claiming that moderaete/liberal Islam does not exist, nor that moderate/liberal Muslims do not exist - indeed, in some heavily Westernized areas, like Bosnia. Albania and Tatarstan, moderate to liberal Muslims are the majority of the population. But this is precisely my.point - Muslim liberalism is almost entirely the result of influences absorbed from less misogynystic cultures or revolt by people whose sensetivity to hypocrisy and injustice is acute enough to override religious brainwashing and societal pressure to conform. If the Q'aran and the Hadith are to be believed - aand they are taken as being authentic records of Mohammeds deeds and sayings by the
majority of Muslims, which is the important thing - Mohammed was a rather extreme misogynyst even by the standards of his time and culture. To claim, as some people do, that all the vile hatred contained in Muslim scriptures is actually a perversion of Mohammeds original, intended message (I've seen people.claim that it is all later Christian and Jewish interpolation, insanely enough) that most Muslims realize this and reject the hateful parts of the Q'aran and Hadith, that fundamentalists in theMuslim world.are a tiny,disenfranchised minority with no credibility who do not have the weight of tradition and theological authority behind them, and that to disagree with theseclaims s nothing but unredeemed racism is so utterly absurd that it crosses the line from utter ignorance to intentional intellectual dishonesy. We should not let guilt over the West's imperialism and warmongering and the continuing poverty.and economic and political disenfranchisement as well as wishful thinking about humanity's innate goodness distrast us from the fact that their institutionalized Abrahamic superstition is as evil as ours distract us from this fact.

P.S? I knowI am going to ruffle a lot of feathers by saying this, but I'll go ahead, anyway. Obviously, I consider.liberal religious belief a lesser evil than fundamentalism, but I still see it as intellectually cowardly. Ifone sees one's religious holy text as being full of hatred, stupidity, ignorance.and absurdity, why not reject the entire wworldview based thereon in toto? I realize that all religious scriptures contain certain ethical precepts, but these precepts are - insofar a sthey are valid ethical rools and not simply bizzare priscriptions against ritual defilement - are almost invariably universal, and have nothing to do with accepting the theological claims made in the aforementioned scriptures. In other words, one does.not need to be.a Christian.to understand and follow the golden rule, nor a Muslim to accept that all men - and
women! - are born wiith the same rights, and reject racism, elitism and tribalism - one need only have a conscience. Why call oneself a Christian,or Muslim when you reject so many of the theological underpinnings of these religions? Is simply being a decent human being with a functioning conscience and brain not enough, and the urge to belong and conform to some large group so powerful and important?

old comment by Nobodyyouknow

@Hassan Prishtina:

If women's legal status is equivalent to men's in Islam, why does Israel have Shariah courts?:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=96355&Page=1#1582284

"Israel actually has official, publicly funded Sharia courts for Muslims, just as they have rabbinical courts for Jews. Not only is sharia law officially recognised by the justice system in Israel in everything regarding the personal status of Muslims, including divorce and marriage, but the judges of the sharia courts are officially appointed by a joint ministerial-parliamentary committee and their salaries paid for by the state."

I really am gigantically stupid, aren't I?

Abubakar Shekau #fundie bbc.com

38 comments

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