Quote# 132882

History as taught in schools is very basic because a) proper history lessons on even small topics would require hundreds of hours, b) 8th graders are not prepared to hear that Columbus was not a great explorer, who discovered America, but a genocidal monster, c) history lessons are an instrument of state propaganda.

Same thing about Stalin: you need a 10 hour lecture on pre-Soviet Russia period, 50 hour lecture on waht it takes to rebuild a country from the ashes of Civil War while preparing for the inevitable second world war, and so on.

In short: 1) no, he did not kill 60 million people. a) there were ~4 million people imprisoned for anti-state crimes (this included sabotage, anti-state propaganda and so on), and 800 thousand were sentenced to death (some of them were not executed) during 1921-1953. b) Stalin was not a "Supreme Leader, who single-handedly invented laws and shot all the dissidents in the head", he had less power than Putin has in modern day Russia.

2) He was not a psycopath.

saint_glo, r/communism101 17 Comments [10/11/2017 2:54:20 PM]
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Pharaoh Bastethotep

Stalin [...] preparing for the inevitable second world war

Hahahahahaha!

10/11/2017 2:56:58 PM

Titania

We studied Communist Russian History for school, and I absolutely hated the mofo! So no excuses, you Commie apologist.

You remind me of Josef Vissarionovich Djugashvili's quote:
“A single death is a tragedy; a million deaths is a statistic.”
? Joseph Stalin

10/11/2017 3:24:59 PM



Columbus was a genocidal monster. Not unlike others such as Stalin who had a bigger body count

10/11/2017 3:38:28 PM

Insult to Rocks

My favorite part of this is that saint-glo thinks that, while 60 million murders is too much to handle, 800 thousand is just the sign of a healthy leader.

10/11/2017 3:51:40 PM

Pharaoh Bastethotep

Columbus was not a great explorer, who discovered America, but a genocidal monster

The wording seems to imply that the two are incompatible with each other.
Of course, that is probably the least of the problems in this quote...

10/11/2017 4:05:24 PM

Citizen Justin

By his own estimate 10 million 'kulaks' had been 'liquidated'. This was during the Second World War, during a meeting with Churchill and Roosevelt, and only a ninny would argue that it was anything other than a gross understatement. Then there was the starvation of people in the Ukraine - either planned and deliberate, or a result of cack-handed agricultural policies, or natural famine, and most likely a combination of all three.

Of course all FSTDT commenters will know this already. The only appeal Stalin should have is to people who hate the world and dream of punishing it for not loving them enough. Much like Hitler, obvs.

10/11/2017 4:29:57 PM

Kanna

"Stalin ....had less power than Putin has in modern day Russia...He was not a psycopath."

Is this comparison intended to be comforting?

10/11/2017 7:12:13 PM

Shepard Solus

History as taught in schools is very basic because a) proper history lessons on even small topics would require hundreds of hours, b) 8th graders are not prepared to hear that Columbus was not a great explorer, who discovered America, but a genocidal monster, c) history lessons are an instrument of state propaganda.

A) I can more or less agree on this one, though it really depends on the subject.
B) Sure they are. Hell, I learned the true story of his intent, voyage & actions well before then. Children aren't the fragile little porcelain dolls that far too many parents are.
C) Ehh... somewhat. My school did make a point of skipping past the end of WW2 and completely avoiding the topic of Vietnam in history. Teacher told us flat out that they were instructed to do so. He seemed pissed. I appreciated that. Not surprising, though, given some of the nonsense that district got up. Like spending several years looking for an excuse to fire the more competent English teacher for teaching us material above our grade's standard, to the point of the assistant dean sitting in on her classes three or four times a month to "evaluate her performance". Or puchasing over 100 new desktop PCs with dual monitors only to put them all in storage after a week and never bring them back out during my time there.

I'm rambling. Twenty-one hours without sleep is taking its toll.

Same thing about Stalin: you need a 10 hour lecture on pre-Soviet Russia period, 50 hour lecture on waht it takes to rebuild a country from the ashes of Civil War while preparing for the inevitable second world war, and so on.

That's fair, too. We need to know far more about the likes of Hitler, Mao and Pol Pot than just "they were bad people". The hows & whys are what's important.

n short: 1) no, he did not kill 60 million people. a) there were ~4 million people imprisoned for anti-state crimes (this included sabotage, anti-state propaganda and so on), and 800 thousand were sentenced to death (some of them were not executed) during 1921-1953. b) Stalin was not a "Supreme Leader, who single-handedly invented laws and shot all the dissidents in the head", he had less power than Putin has in modern day Russia.

And then we divebomb into a string of "nuh uh"s that contradict all the evidence, physical & otherwise, right down to the man's own words.

10/12/2017 12:46:07 AM

Malingspann

"Stalin was not a "Supreme Leader, who single-handedly invented laws and shot all the dissidents in the head""

Stalin: "I lay awake and strap myself in the bed! Put a bulletproof vest on and shoot myself in the head!"

10/12/2017 1:45:07 AM

Philbert McAdamia


2) He was not a psycopath.


You are.

10/12/2017 2:49:34 AM

hydrolythe

"2) He was not a psycopath."

But he privately read "The Prince" by Nicholo Machiavelli as an instruction manual to keep ruling. If that's not psychopathic I don't know what is.

10/12/2017 3:51:19 AM

Azereaux

So the intentional mass starvation in Ukraine just didn't happen or didn't count? Every single one of the people he imprisoned in some of the world's worst prisons deserved it for not toeing the party line? Hundreds of thousands of deaths by execution are excusable? What about the diagnosis of "Sluggishly-Progressing Schizophrenia" that was used to institutionalize political dissidents and subject them to rather harsh "medical" treatments? Implementation of easily disproven and ineffective agricultural practices that led to shortages beyond the intentional ones, and a refusal to change practices because the more efficient and effective way was "bourgeois science"?

Also, in case you forgot, the Soviets sided with the Axis before the Nazis turned on them. Just food for thought.

It seems that you are the one that needs the extensive lecture on the Soviet Union under Stalin. Because clearly you haven't the faintest idea of how fucked up it was.

10/12/2017 6:13:08 AM

Pharaoh Bastethotep

He was not a psycopath.

Correct. He was a psychopath.

10/12/2017 6:24:54 AM



While r/communist101 seems like a pro-Stalin haven, Stalinists do not represent communists as a whole - just as the Westboro Baptist Church does not represent all Christians, and ISIS does not represent all Muslims.

10/12/2017 12:25:21 PM



Nowhere I have seen here makes that claim that Stalin fans represent all communists

10/12/2017 12:58:01 PM

Chloe

b) 8th graders are not prepared to hear that Columbus was not a great explorer, who discovered America, but a genocidal monster,


Why not? You can show them how he and his brothers were arrested and all the people who were appalled by him.

10/12/2017 8:12:10 PM

Indicible

preparing for the inevitable second world war,


Yes, by allying with Hitler.

And what it takes to rebuild a country after a devastating war is not necessarily a dictator. Case in point, France after WW1 and WW2.

10/12/2017 10:37:57 PM

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