The order and beauty, laws and intricacies observable in creation point us to the conclusion that an intelligence has designed it. Order does not arise out of chaos. One strand of DNA is a miracle in itself, cannot be created by accident. "The fool has said in his heart there is no God."
Our choices are two: either there is eternal matter that with no outside influence created life on its own, or there is an Eternal Creator, beyond our minds and logic, beyond our laws of time and physics, who has created the order and beauty we observe. The first choice is unacceptable to human dignity; the second, answers to our innate sense of responsibility for our behavior or misbehavior. Indeed this is the root of the desire for there to be "no God": we don't want to face the Judge. But, good news, the Judge has sent His Son to pay our price just as it was predicted 700 years before it happened by Isaiah.
--Need proof of God? - Study the history of the Jewish people.
24 comments
"Oh look at that...it is so pretty and could be slightly more chaotic than it is now...it must have been created by a magical space-man!"
Gotta love how every argument for God just amounts to feelings and non-sequitirs.
"One strand of DNA is a miracle in itself, cannot be created by accident. "
And yet, it happened.
"But, good news, the Judge has sent His Son to pay our price just as it was predicted 700 years before it happened by Isaiah. "
Wow! A story written 700 years later, by SOMEONE WHO READ THE BOOK AND FOLLOWED THE RELIGION, matched up with a 700-year-old prophecy?! Holy SHIT, what are the odds?!</sarcasm>
Even if you managed to convince me that there is a God, which your flimsy arguement failed to do. How does that relate in any way to the God of the bible? If there is a God or Gods, why would it necessarily be your God? Why not the Gods of the ancient Egyptians, or the Gods worshipped by pre-colonisation Pacific Islanders, or the flying spaghetti monster or some God we have never thought of?
There is a massive leap between "there is an Eternal Creator, beyond our minds and logic, beyond our laws of time and physics" and the anthropomorphic, jealous, petty, misogynistic God of the Israelites.
"The order and beauty, laws and intricacies observable in creation point us to the conclusion that an intelligence has designed it."
I agree, if we were living in the 1700's before someone enlightened us on these issues.
"Order does not arise out of chaos. One strand of DNA is a miracle in itself, cannot be created by accident."
Agree again, it wasn't 'created' at all.
"The first choice is unacceptable to human dignity; the second, answers to our innate sense of responsibility for our behavior or misbehavior."
Neither of which have anything to do with the beginnings of life.
"--Need proof of God? - Study the history of the Jewish people."
...God hates us? Cause they haven't really had the greatest of time in the past couple centuries.
"Our choices are two"
That we know of.
"The first choice is unacceptable to human dignity"
lolwhut? This isn't about dignity. Philosophy is about the truth, whether we like or not.
"--Need proof of God? - Study the history of the Jewish people."
So people who think they're God's chosen people end up tormented and hated even though God loves them the most? Weird.
Apologists always offer a God "beyond our minds and logic, beyond our laws of time and physics ..."
If these attributes are accurate, then God is utterly incomprehensible and unknowable. Such modes of existence are completely foreign to the human mind, rendering the God concept incoherent.
truthseeker,
You said, "...beyond our minds and logic, beyond our laws of time and physics", and with that I am inclined to agree.
However, the crude and selfish antics of your god are beyond repugnance, clearly not in the same category.
I'm beginning to find myself in agreement with you on another point, which is Jesus being a Savior. A man who went among the Judaic people, working to -- and here is where I diverge -- liberate his countrymen from a god who was in actuality a Chaos creature.
He failed, and your book is evidence enough of that.
. But, good news, the Judge has sent His Son to pay our price just as it was predicted 700 years before it happened by Isaiah.
Big deal. Rand al'Thor is fulfilling the 3000 year old Prophecies of the Dragon.
That's 2, 300 more years than yours.
"... there is an Eternal Creator, beyond our minds and logic, beyond our laws of time and physics ..."
... and if you aren't a devout (Baptist/Catholic/Muslim/insert applicable religion here), he'll personally see to it that you suffer for all eternity.
The Jews...you mean the people that have been discriminated against, forced into ghettos, and slaughtered by the millions, for thousands of years? Seems like that's proof that god doesn't give a shit about them either. So much for that whole "chosen people" thing. Not hating on Jewish people at all, but it seems like their religion has never done them any favors, and maybe has even caused people to hate them more than they ever deserved. Christianity hasn't done them any favors either. I say do away with both religions.
Whether or not a theory is acceptable to human dignity is irrelevant to the analysis of its truth value. Human beings forming from completely natural processes might not be as dignified to you, but that doesn't change the fact that we are likely here due to sheer chance. If the only thing that you think makes life worth living is the belief that some higher being has given you some amazing purpose for your life, then you live a lame existence.
Order does not arise out of chaos.
Sure it does. For example, look up "Chaos Theory" and you'll see plenty of examples of order arising out of chaos. No "designer" needed! (Chaos Theory is actually really interesting; I recommend reading up on it if any of you have some spare time.)
"Order does not arise out of chaos."
Crystals, snowflakes, bird flocks, fish shoals, superconductivity, Fitzhugh-Nagumo reaction-diffusion, Langmuir-Blodgett reactions, emergent metastability and stigmergy all say you are wrong.
For me, reality trumps mythology every time.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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