I'm an economist by trade, and thought I would try my hand at describing an simple economic analysis of religious decision-making... Now let's assume that there are only two possible religious choices in the world: Christianity and Atheism... So take infinite blessings and subtract, say 70 years of pain and suffering for being a Christian while on Earth, and the result is still infinity. If you're an atheist, assume 70 years of pure pleasure and no costs whatsoever, and the result is still 0. If you're an atheist, and this economic analysis hasn't convinced you, then you have just shown that many people don't make rational decisions when it comes to accepting or rejecting Jesus Christ.Now, assume you're God, and a person has refused to believe in you and refusing to accept Jesus Christ, despite such clear and convincing evidence. What might be a logical punishment for such a person?
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I'm going to forgo my usual polite restraint to better bark at this particular fucking idiot.
First, you smug, disingenuous bastard, the choice is not some simplistic dichotomy. Of course if you did list all the religions to choose from we could be here all night. Pascal's Wager is as wrong as it has always been and one would have to have been dwelling beneath a fucking rock not to realise it these days - or else be an utter cretin. This argument is useless if there are more than two options to choose from, as there are anywhere but your absurd little fantasyland.
Quite apart from the fact that True_Blue only even attempts to consider the cost/benefits in the scenario in which their absurd fairytale is true, (Bliss times 70) - 0 is not, so far as I can tell, equal to Zero.
If you're reading this, and True_Blue's economic analysis has convinced you, then you have just shown that you are easily swayed by absolute drivel and should not go out without a minder.
>>Now, assume you're God, and a person has refused to believe in you and refusing to accept Jesus Christ, despite such clear and convincing evidence. What might be a logical punishment for such a person?<<
If I were God and also a sick, sadistic fucker with no compassion or morals I might throw them into a lake of fire for all eternity. If I were also as inconsistent and arbitrary as the God of the bible I may well throw in the believers too (pending my ability to invent something better).
A more reasonable (but still not perfectly loving) God would be more likely to punish those who fell for this piss-poor piece of shit instead.
I? I would likely reward them for seeing through it, not punish.
True_Blue is henceforth renamed Pope_Lying_Sack_Of_Crap by decree of the Reverend Tyrant of the Seven Seas.
Sincerely,
The Same.
Pascal's Wager isn't "clear and convincing evidence". It isn't evidence at all. Aside from that, you're oversimplifying the problem to the point of absurdity (there are more religions than just Christianity, many of which also claim infidels go to a sort of hell) and ignoring the relative likelihood of being right or wrong. If the odds of your being right are zero, it doesn't really matter how good things would be if you are right.
So, True_Blue, does being a economist excuse you from plagerizing from Pascal, since he came up with this about 300 odd years ago?
And since Pascal was refering to Catholicism, I assume you're a Catholic also, right?
Now, as others pointed out, the possibilies aren't God/No God... they are No God/Allah(Shite)/Allah(Sunni)/YHWH/Jesus(Catholic)/Jesus(Orthodox)/Jesus(Lutheran)/Jesus(hundreds of other versions)/Hindu(also hundreds of versions)/Animist(more hundreds)/Pagan(still more hundreds)/and the hundreds of thousands that I've missed.
Since the odds of any of these being true are roughly the same, and the punishment for being wrong is horrible to imagine for all of them... which do you choose, mr. economist? What rational decision do you make?
Now assume you are an economist, and a parent. Your child just broke your favorite slide rule that you had told him/her not to ever touch. Would you throw the child in a lit fireplace or the oven? If so, for how long? 5min? 10min? Infinity?
If you're a christian and this practical analysis hasn't convinced you, then you have just shown that many people don't make rational decisions when it comes to accepting that you do not believe in a loving god.
Now, assume you're God, and a person has refused to believe in you and refusing to accept Jesus Christ, despite such clear and convincing evidence. What might be a logical punishment for such a person?"
I guess I'd shrug and move on with my eternal existence. Hey, you win some, you lose some.
Now let's assume that there are only two possible religious choices in the world: Christianity and Atheism...
ERRRRRRRNNNNT. You lose.
Now, assume you're God, and a person has refused to believe in you and refusing to accept Jesus Christ, despite such clear and convincing evidence. What might be a logical punishment for such a person?"
God thinks exactly like a petty minded American Christian of the 21st century and craves revenge. Who knew?
Now let's assume that there are only two possible religious choices in the world: Christianity and Atheism...
False,,, so everything else based on that assumption is also false.
Okay, TB, let us assume there are only two things you can do with your money, set light to it and shove it up your ass, or give it to me.
If you chose the first option, you'll at best end up with no money, at worst you'll receive severe intestinal injuries or even die.
But if you give all your money to me, there's a chance I might feel guilty when passing you, your wife and kids huddling together by the dumpsters in the limo I bought with your money and chuck your a couple of notes for a warm meal.
So your choices are either poverty with the possibility of death, or poverty with the possibility of a warm meal. So why haven't you given me all your money yet? I mean, you're an economist, surely you can see that "trickle down" is a better option than a flaming dollar suppository, right?
On the other hand; if whatever god exists promotes good deeds done for the benefit of others, not for your own gain, you, who help others to score god-points, get 70 years of pain and suffering for being a Christian, then infinity in the burning pits of Gehenna, while the atheist, who helped his fellow men and women because they needed help, gets 70 years of pure pleasure and no costs whatsoever and infinity of heaven afterwards.
A logical punishment, presuming that I actually was God, would be to ignore said atheist in the same way that they ignore me. Basically, I wouldn't worry about the atheists.
pascal's wager ?
ok, lets say there are 20 religions in the world and atheism and agnoticism. What is the return on that ?
Worship the christian god your whole life and meet Cthulu at judgement and your ass is fried.
false premise to start with. What about Thor, Odin, FSM , IPU, Cthulhu ? You need a really big table to evaluate all world religions througout history.
a logical punishment ? one of my creations great great etc grandchildren didnt believe in me because of all the evidence I planted so being a kind and loving God I let them into a nice place and go talk to them every so often.
Sadly I am sane and not a berserk sociopath.
"If you're an atheist, and this economic analysis hasn't convinced you, then you have just shown that many people don't make rational decisions when it comes to accepting or rejecting Jesus Christ"
Unfortunately, it seems the whole "rational decision" part flew right past you there.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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