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#1040923
Oni
"The Bible claims to be the Word of God. 2 Timothy 3:16 states that every word of Scripture is inspired by God. 2 Peter 1:21 says that men of God wrote as they were “driven along” by the Holy Spirit."
so because the bible says it's the word of god, it is the word of god? too easy.
10/21/2009 7:59:58 PM
#1040926
SleepNeed
Every time there is a scientific or historical fact mentioned in the Bible, it has been shown to be true (the earth is round, currents in the sea, the prevailing winds, etc.)
From:
Leviticus 11:20-23
20 " 'All flying insects that walk on all fours are to be detestable to you. 21 There are, however, some winged creatures that walk on all fours that you may eat: those that have jointed legs for hopping on the ground.
Yea, real scientifically accurate. Everybody knows that insects have four legs...
10/21/2009 8:03:58 PM
#1040927
iflurry
Next up: Why other holy books that say the exact same thing are evil lies from Satan!
10/21/2009 8:04:11 PM
#1040928
louislois
"Many Bible prophecies have already been fulfilled. There are thousands of prophecies in the Bible that have come true. Jesus Himself fulfilled over 600 through His life, death, and resurrection. Because so many prophecies in the Bible have already come true, we can trust that the rest will be fulfilled in the future'"
I'd ask for citation, but I have a suspicious feeling you pulled these figures out of your backside.
".... Otherwise, we are picking and choosing only what we want to believe."
What do you mean "otherwise"? That's what you fundies do best.
10/21/2009 8:05:16 PM
#1040932
Sweet Fancy Moses
* If the Bible is not true, then we have no basis for claiming we have been saved from our sins. It is only because of the Bible that we can say our sins have been forgiven
And it is only because of the Bible that you believe in sin, so, that works itself out.
10/21/2009 8:11:29 PM
#1040933
Ouabache
1) Circular reasoning.
2) Confirmation bias.
3) Circular reasoning.
4) Circular reasoning AND confirmation bias.
5) Non sequitur.
NEXT PLEASE!
10/21/2009 8:11:38 PM
#1040935
Mudak
But the very selection of the Bible means you're picking and choosing. Where to begin?
There isn't enough water on the planet to prove a global flood.
Rabbits don't chew their cud.
If you like either a cheeseburger or pepperoni pizza you're mixing meat and dairy, counter to Leviticus' rules.
Tattoos. Have you got one?
Pi is not equal to 3.
I sincerely hope you don't force your daughter to marry her rapist, as the Bible says you should.
I could go on, but I'm bored...
10/21/2009 8:13:28 PM
#1040943
campbunny
That's funny, every single one of those five reasons is a complete joke of an argument.
10/21/2009 8:25:46 PM
#1040945
Zoo
"The Bible claims to be the Word of God."
So I can write something that includes a statement that my cat wrote it and you'll believe it?
"The Bible shows itself to be the Word of God. Every time there is a scientific or historical fact mentioned in the Bible, it has been shown to be true (the earth is round, currents in the sea, the prevailing winds, etc.). Even when a civilization mentioned has not been heard of before, archaeology eventually finds evidence that it really did exist."
Does it really? So. . . why is there still no evidence for creation?
"Jesus Christ quoted from the Bible and believed it to be true"
That's just fine if he's an incarnation of God, but where is the evidence for that other than in the Bible?
"Many Bible prophecies have already been fulfilled."
You mean those things that are vague like horoscopes?
"If the Bible is not true, then we have no basis for claiming we have been saved from our sins."
True. But we also have no need for being saved from sin or defining things as sin. There's just consideration for other people and the actual consequences of actions.
10/21/2009 8:32:53 PM
#1040952
silvrwlf
Yes, this is a fundie statement. All of it. Except...."If we trust the Bible for our salvation,"
Um, I thought that the Bible (and all you believe in?) says that it is JESUS that saves, not the Bible. So being a good person can't "save" you, but AIG apparently thinks the Bible can. So, since we have Bible's in our house (my husband's a (non-fundie) Christian), does that mean I'm saved, too? I've even read it a few times.
Okay, back to harassing the fundie for the truly fundie things...
10/21/2009 8:42:16 PM
#1040956
Semi-Christian
Wow...just wow. So much stupidity....and circular reasoning.
10/21/2009 8:54:04 PM
#1040962
Doctor Whom
1.
2. Including the earth that cannot be moved and the four-legged insects?
3. See my answer to 1 above.
4. Many have been disproved, and we know what your Bible says about prophets whose success rate is less than 100%.
5. See my answer to 1 above, and by the way, I've never met a Christian who didn't pick and choose only what she or he wanted to believe.
10/21/2009 9:02:01 PM
#1040964
Horsefeathers
"There are many reasons we believe the Bible and all that it contains:"
Yes, but are they good reasons?
"* The Bible claims to be the Word of God. 2 Timothy 3:16 states that every word of Scripture is inspired by God. 2 Peter 1:21 says that men of God wrote as they were “driven along” by the Holy Spirit."
That's nice. Now show actual evidence that it is, indeed, the "word of god" as it claims to be. I can point to many, many places that show it is no such thing. How many can you point to that show it is?
"* The Bible shows itself to be the Word of God. Every time there is a scientific or historical fact mentioned in the Bible, it has been shown to be true (the earth is round, currents in the sea, the prevailing winds, etc.). Even when a civilization mentioned has not been heard of before, archaeology eventually finds evidence that it really did exist."
Every time there is a scientific fact mentioned your Bible is dead fucking wrong. Every time an historical fact is mentioned I give it a 50/50 chance of being inaccurate. Generally it gets places correct. Occasionally it gets people right. Anything beyond that, particularly when it comes down to specifics such as customs and numbers it's not so hot.
"* Jesus Christ quoted from the Bible and believed it to be true. Jesus used the Bible when He was being tempted by Satan. He also quoted the Bible numerous times and stated that He was fulfilling Scripture."
Again, that's nice and all but it doesn't mean a damned thing. You're using an argument from authority. Generally people stray into fallacious territory by citing someone that's not an expert on the topic in question. You, however, are citing someone as an authority that may not have even fucking existed.
"* Many Bible prophecies have already been fulfilled. There are thousands of prophecies in the Bible that have come true. Jesus Himself fulfilled over 600 through His life, death, and resurrection. Because so many prophecies in the Bible have already come true, we can trust that the rest will be fulfilled in the future."
First of all: Tyre.
Second of all: Jesus did not fulfill the prophecies that are required of the Messiah. Why the hell do you think there are still Jews you moron? I'm pretty sure that the people who wrote the fucking rules would know if someone had fulfilled them.
"* If the Bible is not true, then we have no basis for claiming we have been saved from our sins. It is only because of the Bible that we can say our sins have been forgiven. If we trust the Bible for our salvation, we must trust everything it says. Otherwise, we are picking and choosing only what we want to believe."
Show sin exists. Until then this claim is meaningless.
10/21/2009 9:03:47 PM
#1040968
Tolpuddle Martyr
"Otherwise, we are picking and choosing only what we want to believe.
Oh you wouldn't do that would you? Cue the open letter to Dr. Laura...
Dear Dr. Laura:
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws and how to follow them:
When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15:19- 24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?
I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?
A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?
Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?
Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?
I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.
Your devoted fan,
Jim
10/21/2009 9:10:31 PM
#1040972
GodotIsWaiting4U
* The Bible claims to be the Word of God. 2 Timothy 3:16 states that every word of Scripture is inspired by God. 2 Peter 1:21 says that men of God wrote as they were “driven along” by the Holy Spirit.
So it's true because it says it is.
* The Bible shows itself to be the Word of God. Every time there is a scientific or historical fact mentioned in the Bible, it has been shown to be true (the earth is round, currents in the sea, the prevailing winds, etc.). Even when a civilization mentioned has not been heard of before, archaeology eventually finds evidence that it really did exist.
No, the Bible says the Earth is a CIRCLE, not a SPHERE. Hebrew had distinct words for these things.
* Jesus Christ quoted from the Bible and believed it to be true. Jesus used the Bible when He was being tempted by Satan. He also quoted the Bible numerous times and stated that He was fulfilling Scripture.
JOSEPH SMITH WAS CALLED A PROPHET, DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB!
* Many Bible prophecies have already been fulfilled. There are thousands of prophecies in the Bible that have come true. Jesus Himself fulfilled over 600 through His life, death, and resurrection. Because so many prophecies in the Bible have already come true, we can trust that the rest will be fulfilled in the future.
By bizarre twisted interpretations of vague prophecies, sure. What about the prophecies that HAVEN'T been fulfilled?
* If the Bible is not true, then we have no basis for claiming we have been saved from our sins. It is only because of the Bible that we can say our sins have been forgiven. If we trust the Bible for our salvation, we must trust everything it says. Otherwise, we are picking and choosing only what we want to believe.
You also have no basis for claiming that you've been sinning, so the whole question becomes moot, doesn't it now?
10/21/2009 9:15:19 PM
#1040975
Porky Pine
"* The Bible claims to be the Word of God. 2 Timothy 3:16 states that every word of Scripture is inspired by God. 2 Peter 1:21 says that men of God wrote as they were “driven along” by the Holy Spirit. "
Circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works.
"* The Bible shows itself to be the Word of God. Every time there is a scientific or historical fact mentioned in the Bible, it has been shown to be true (the earth is round, currents in the sea, the prevailing winds, etc.). Even when a civilization mentioned has not been heard of before, archaeology eventually finds evidence that it really did exist. "
Kansas is mentioned in "The Wizard of Oz". Doesn't make the story true.
"* Jesus Christ quoted from the Bible and believed it to be true. Jesus used the Bible when He was being tempted by Satan. He also quoted the Bible numerous times and stated that He was fulfilling Scripture. "
This is so wrong in so many levels.
"* Many Bible prophecies have already been fulfilled. There are thousands of prophecies in the Bible that have come true. Jesus Himself fulfilled over 600 through His life, death, and resurrection. Because so many prophecies in the Bible have already come true, we can trust that the rest will be fulfilled in the future. \"
Most of them were made to fit events. Other's have never come true at all.
"* If the Bible is not true, then we have no basis for claiming we have been saved from our sins. It is only because of the Bible that we can say our sins have been forgiven. If we trust the Bible for our salvation, we must trust everything it says. Otherwise, we are picking and choosing only what we want to believe. "
Guess what. You're doing that anyway.
10/21/2009 9:18:46 PM
#1040988
Vince
ok
pointless and bullshit. and what kind of material is the shirt your wearing? really, it's more important then you you seem to know.
10/21/2009 9:42:14 PM
#1040989
Thejebusfire
The Bible claims to be the Word of God.
Every religion says that about their religious books.
Every time there is a scientific or historical fact mentioned in the Bible, it has been shown to be true (the earth is round
Even when a civilization mentioned has not been heard of before, archaeology eventually finds evidence that it really did exist.
{citation needed}
Jesus Christ quoted from the Bible and believed it to be true.
Jesus was Jewish dumbass.
There are thousands of prophecies in the Bible that have come true.
Again, all religions say this.
Jesus Himself fulfilled over 600 through His life, death, and resurrection.
[citation needed]
If the Bible is not true, then we have no basis for claiming we have been saved from our sins.
If the bible isn't true then neither is "sin".
It is only because of the Bible that we can say our sins have been forgiven.
You're confusing the bible for Jesus.
If we trust the Bible for our salvation, we must trust everything it says.
See the above.
Otherwise, we are picking and choosing only what we want to believe.
Like you do?
10/21/2009 9:43:04 PM
#1040992
M.M.
There are many reasons we believe the Bible and all that it contains:
* The Bible claims to be the Word of God.
In a nutshell: "We believe the bible because the bible says so." Nice job, AiG.
10/21/2009 9:45:13 PM
#1040993
Sasha
I got dizzy from reading that.
10/21/2009 9:46:08 PM
#1040999
Tom S. Fox
@Ouabache, 5) is more like an argument from consequences.
10/21/2009 9:58:29 PM
#1041000
raindrops
Would it not have been simpler if you just write that you believe in bullshit?
10/21/2009 9:58:57 PM
#1041003
Musicalbookworm
Is there any part of your argument that is not either circular or utter bullshit?
10/21/2009 10:09:02 PM
#1041007
BobsOldSocks
"* The Bible claims to be the Word of God. 2 Timothy 3:16 states that every word of Scripture is inspired by God. 2 Peter 1:21 says that men of God wrote as they were “driven along” by the Holy Spirit."
Circular reasoning, logical fallacy.
"* The Bible shows itself to be the Word of God. Every time there is a scientific or historical fact mentioned in the Bible, it has been shown to be true (the earth is round..."
The bible claims the Earth is *flat*. You're either ignorant of the book you worship or you're a liar.
"* Jesus Christ quoted from the Bible and believed it to be true. Jesus used the Bible when He was being tempted by Satan. He also quoted the Bible numerous times and stated that He was fulfilling Scripture."
Jesus did not exist, he was a fictional character. Got any evidence for his existence outwith the bible? No, didn't think so.
"* Many Bible prophecies have already been fulfilled."
It's called "postdiction", i.e. lies.
"* If the Bible is not true, then we have no basis for claiming we have been saved from our sins."
You're labouring under (another) misapprehension: "sin" does not exist.
"Otherwise, we are picking and choosing only what we want to believe."
Yeah, and christians would *never* do that, would they? They wouldn't, for instance, ignore verses about stoning their own children to death for disobedience while at the same time rabidly foaming at the mouth about verses on homosexuality *in the exact same book*, now would they? It also would account for the more than 38,000 christian denominations; face it, you lot don't know yer arse from next Tuesday.
10/21/2009 10:19:54 PM
#1041009
Osiris
1. So?
2. Only the Bible also mentions things that are flat out wrong.
3. How could Jesus believe in the Bible when it wasn't compiled five hundred years after he died?
4. Let's do a thought experiment. If Jesus was a fictional character, then how hard would it be the make up someone and claim he fulfilled all the prophecies. Also Jews continue to believe that Jesus didn't fulfill any of them.
5. If the Bible is not true we have no basis to believe in sin in the first place.
10/21/2009 10:27:19 PM
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