Quote# 89869

Suppose that you and I make a contract that, in exchange for you giving me a badly-needed $20 today, I will mow your lawn tomorrow. Then suppose that after I spend the money, I change my mind about the wisdom of this deal. Can I repudiate the contract on the grounds that my labor for you is no longer voluntary? If so, then people will have no incentive to provide payment for services in advance, and it will hinder the economy in many cases.

Why do we need a rule against people selling themselves into slavery? When has that ever been a common practice? If someone is dumb enough to do so, don't they deserve the consequences? Those people will, like many other losers, weed themselves (and their foolish tendencies) out of society in a Darwinian manner, and it will cease to be a problem. But in order for that to happen, you have to let the market be free.

LibertyNow, LibertyNow Wiki 46 Comments [10/2/2012 3:38:45 AM]
Fundie Index: 47
Submitted By: TheReasonator

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So taking a potential consumer out if the economy is helpful for the economy?

If you're so opposed to laws and rules that protect us from ourselves, let me take the labels off of a couple of bottles. One has water in it and the other has poison. Drink up while you're not wearing a seatbelt on a road with no speed limit.

10/2/2012 3:54:33 AM


Contract law fail!

1. Specific performance is an equitable remedy, and therefore discretionary. It is not available if damages are adequate recompense.

2. All your children are belong to us, I suppose?

10/2/2012 4:05:23 AM

Filin De Blanc

A Darwinian manner? But I thought Darwin was one of those dreadful evilutionists.

10/2/2012 4:10:27 AM


Typical moron libertarian, let the market be free but not the worker.

10/2/2012 5:03:12 AM

Mister Spak

Are you saying we need a free market in slave labor?

10/2/2012 5:22:16 AM

Doubting Thomas

I agree to a certain extent in that people should know what they're getting into before getting into it, but unfortunately these kinds of laws are necessary to prevent people from taking advantage of others.

10/2/2012 5:24:34 AM

D Laurier

The irony.
Someone calling themselves "LibertyNow" is calling for the legalzation of slavery

10/2/2012 5:32:34 AM


At least this one keeps it logically coherent. Yes, the free market leads to slavery (I do, in this case not consider European markets as free, but as social markets).

10/2/2012 5:43:46 AM


Okay, you get drunk one night or, better yet, someone drugs you. You signed away your freedom and didn't even know it. Or, let's say you are installing software and they write a clause into the digital agreement in hexidecimal notation. Now you're a slave. According to your logic you should now accept being a slave and you deserve the consequences.

10/2/2012 5:53:50 AM

Dr. Razark

"Can I repudiate the contract on the grounds that my labor for you is no longer voluntary?"

No. There's a reason people go to court for breach of contract. That doesn't mean you can legalize slavery.

10/2/2012 6:02:25 AM


Yes, someone can accept $20 in exchange for future services rendered -- it happens so frequently that there is an actual name for it, "default". The creditor's remedies are limited to seeking financial compensation, as laid out in the contract (if there was one), statue, and other factors.

10/2/2012 6:27:18 AM

No they can't force you to provide the service but they are allowed to (and should) sue you to get their money back.

The example given is a good demonstration why there should be more government regulation (i.e. consumer protection), not less.

10/2/2012 6:33:12 AM


Anyone who really feels they should be free to own others needs to remove themselves from the gene pool, posthaste.

10/2/2012 6:39:36 AM


Libertarians have to be the most ass backwards individuals in politics I've ever seen. It's like they don't understand that a completely free market is just as bad as a completely restricted one. I'm already a wage slave, I don't' need to be an *actual* slave because these idiots want to throw me under the bus.

10/2/2012 7:10:40 AM


Your straw man was torched in 1973, in the movie The Paper Chase... not to mention specific legislation and court arguments predating that by several centuries in civilized countries.

Argumentum ex ignoramus.

10/2/2012 7:29:58 AM

Rabbit of Caerbannog

Calls himself LibertyNow

Supports slavery

10/2/2012 7:35:42 AM


Why do we need a rule against people selling themselves into slavery? When has that ever been a common practice?

It was a common way to get to the New World back in the 16th century. Indentured servitude: look it up. For that matter, it's was pretty frequent throughout history, and in some countries today. Desperate people do desperate things ... and not always voluntarily.

But LibertyNow prefers a world where someone can coerce you into signing a piece of paper, or simply forge your signature (easier if you're illiterate) and enslave you ... and somehow you must get to a court and prove you didn't freely sign up to be imprisoned and abused before anyone lifts a finger for you. I wonder what he (she?) would think of a completely free market if he ended up as a commodity in human trafficking.

10/2/2012 7:37:22 AM

Thinking Allowed

You do realize that having a contract to mow someone's yard in exchange for the $20 one time does not mean slavery. It's called a contract and you refusing to mow someone's yard one time is a breech of contract.

10/2/2012 7:46:26 AM

honoring an agreement is not slavery. If you dont want or are unable to do the work then make arangement to repay the money.

10/2/2012 7:48:45 AM

Filin De Blanc

If you want to be a slave so badly, that's what the BDSM community is for.

10/2/2012 8:02:21 AM


HEy. Hey.


Social Darwinism was actually disputed by Darwin. The guy who made it up was an insane elitist who believed the poor should die and would because they have 'bad genes'. It's just eugenics by another name.

So basically, LibertyNow has a similar platform as Nazis and an Insane Dead Guy. Good work.

10/2/2012 8:12:50 AM


"...weed themselves (and their foolish tendencies) out of society in a Darwinian manner..."

Social Darwinists are the scum of the Earth. They are also often evolution deniers.

10/2/2012 8:13:03 AM


How about if we make a contract that, in exchange for me giving you a badly-needed $20 today, you will mow my lawn tomorrow, be locked in my barn, forbidden to go out or have any friends of your own or go to the church of your choice, and you'll be beaten if you don't mow the lawn fast enough, and I can have sex with your girlfriend any time I like?

There's a bit of a difference between a slave and an employee.

Can I repudiate the contract on the grounds that my labor for you is no longer voluntary?

Your labor is still voluntary, but you're in violation of the contract and I'm entitled to monetary damages, which include at least a return of the $20 bucks plus collection costs.

10/2/2012 9:17:02 AM


Well, in your case, LN, I then hire Jesus & Son, Gardeners and Landscapers.

As they come highly regarded by others (word of mouth is just as good as advertising) in my neighbourhood, and they do an excellent job in lawn mowing, hedge-trimming (even Topiary to your requirements) etc; extremely reliable they are too. Their fees are a little bit more than your average lawn mower crews/individuals, but the fact they always take away the clippings/cuttings etc means that they care.

...and I don't care about you ever mowing my lawn ever again. I'll make it well known to everyone in the locale that you'r not only someone who can never be trusted, you're also a thief and a deal-welsher.

Darwin'Darwinism' non-sequiturs required.

10/2/2012 9:46:56 AM


Ahhh it's the Freedumb movement!

10/2/2012 9:58:31 AM

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