www.christiannews.net

Tony Demarcus, Ph.D., D. D. #fundie christiannews.net

Reasonable Conservative:
First of all, when attempting to quote the Bible, use the Christian Bible and not a Cathlic counterfeit. To wit, "Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak." Matthew 26:40

Relative to your false idea that real Christians, those who been Saved by the real Jesus (as opposed to believing that they were Saved by fictional Jesus, such as that of Mormons or Cathlics), may knowingly choose to sin, have you actually read the Christian Bible?? The Christian Bible teaches us that once we are Saved, we're saints--not sinners! Duh. Unfortunately the space on this message board doesn't allow the Christian to present a proper thesis on the subject. But there are good news! Brother Wally Langford is an esteemed and illustrious Christian pastor that used to post some of his Biblical sermons on youtube. You can find it by searching for his moniker there: preachthehelloutofya . In his channel you can find sermon called "you might be one, but I'm not."

It is therefore, your assignment to study the message within so that one day you may fully understand the WHOLE meaning of the Christian Bible.

WorldGoneCrazy #fundie christiannews.net

A secular ontological proof of the existence of your future home, lest you repent:

1. Every natural innate human desire has a corresponding satisfying object in reality. (e.g., thirst has the object of water, hunger has the object of food, love has the object of persons and dogs, like me :-), knowledge has the object of reality perceived through our five senses plus the enormous complexity-resolving hardware and software of our brain, etc) (observation and human experience)

2. Humans possess a natural innate desire for objective moral justice to be satisfied. (human psychology; in fact, this desire is so strong that even many atheists will utter the phrase “Go to Hell”)

3. Therefore, objective moral justice exists. (1,2 Modus Ponens)

4. If objective moral justice exists, then it exists for everyone – otherwise, it would not be objective, moral, or justice. (definition of objective moral justice)

5. Therefore, objective moral justice exists for everyone. (4,3 Modus Ponens)

6. If objective moral justice exists for everyone, then it must exist in this life or a potential afterlife for everyone. (complete disjunction on potential human existence)

7. Therefore, objective moral justice must exist in this life or an afterlife for everyone. (6,5 Modus Ponens)

8. For some persons, objective moral justice is not satisfied in this lifetime. (e.g., Hitler, Stalin, Mao, unrepentant abortion "doctors," abortuary deathscorts, etc) (observation regarding heinous atrocities whose perpetrators never received OMJ in this life)

9. Therefore, for some persons, objective moral justice is satisfied in an afterlife. (simple cancellation)

10. Therefore, objective moral justice exists in an afterlife, i.e., Hell exists. (existential generalization)

(Special thanks to the following atheist-agnostics, and others unnamed, who provided constructive criticisms helping me to identify hidden steps: Elie, markb, Unrepentant Atheist, and Disqusdmnj. Any remaining errors are mine and mine alone.)

TheWorldIsDoomed #fundie #homophobia christiannews.net

TheWorldIsDoomed:
Even if you dont believe in a creator God, you cant dismiss biology. We see this in the animal kingdom, male and female mating. Its the natural order.
The anus is not a sexual organ. Its for excrement/waste.
The homosexual lifestyle has serious consequences, ie risk of aids/hiv, colon cancers, high suicide rate in lgbtq, high level of domestic violence etc.
To advertise cereal promoting the minority groups of lgbtq on young impressionable minds is careless and unloving.
Children need to be taught the natural order of relationships/sex/pro creation

Justus Jonas:
Why are you discussing the anus? Lesbians represent 50% of the homosexual population, how often do you think they engage in Anal sex? And what about all the straight couples who DO?

TheWorldIsDoomed:
Why do lesbians feel the need to use phallic sex toys? (Shows that homosexuals cannot escape the natural order of sexual intimacy)
Or, why is it, when you see, lets say, male homos (for short) theres always the "feminine" one, and the more manly one.
Same with female homos. Theres always a bloke looking one, and a more female one.

Jeriah Knox #fundie christiannews.net

Only a belief system will claim to know when the baby should have human rights and be protected from the big people that want to kill it. The woman that walks into the clinic to abort her child is depending on a belief just like the Christian is depending on a belief to say no, the child has rights. Why are abortion loving belief systems government sanctioned, government funded, taught in our government schools, and written into our laws.

Why do belief systems which preach abortion rights, also preach the moral goodness of promiscuity, homosexuality, pornography, and transgendering? There is an underlying belief system that ties these beliefs together. Those that oppose Christian street preaching, do so from a particular belief system. People need to stop pretending they don't believe and recognize what they have already believed, the belief system by which they live their lives.

Eldrida Urika #fundie christiannews.net

To be honest for the evolutionist that say we come from apes is one of the biggest problems with the theory to anyone who looks at it, is if we developed from apes, why do apes still exist but do not evolve into humans as our 'predecessors' did. That is totally unlikely to have happened if we came from the apes ourselves. Even if all of them didn't turn into humans, I would think that the odd one would still evolve into a human just by the same coincidence. The odds are more for it than against that happening in that belief.
Otherwise, it makes no sense and supports our belief that God made male and female just like His Word in the bible states. That's how I've thought since I was little and heard that man came from apes. I wasn't Christian to have another belief to compare it to either. It makes no logical sense, nor is it reasonable to accept for some of us.
So just why don't the apes become human not even the 1 in a trillion that would be expected to go beyond the others and become a human too. Your proof are skeletons and human skulls and if God made us similar, it doesn't mean one came the other, it means they have similar skeletons/skulls to ours. Pigs have similar enough hearts to use in transplants, does that mean we also come from pigs? Why does one animals similarities get to be accepted as the reason but another's isn't - and that is not just the pig that has attributes that humans have too.
We all breathe the same way. we all eat and digest the same way. Our vision is similar to our pets, and can need corrective lens too. So with all the different similarities, why does just one qualify to be our predecessor? Wouldn't it be more reasonable to believe that we are a combination of all the animals than that only one qualifies as our origin.
I'm sorry if this is not what you expected but I've had a long time to think about this without the Christian perspective too. These are the questions I need answered before I could even come close to evolution being something that actually answered the question of where humans came from when I believe in God and believe that he does not lie. He is too beyond us than to need to lie. He can do anything why would he even bother to lie? We can't even come close to imagining what he is capable of knowing or doing. It's beyond our abilities to think like God, so we can't be confident in anything but the Word in the Bible, because if you believe in God, you are aware of his power without needing to question the things he does because of being God.
That's why we cannot imagine that we come from apes.

PecosOasis #fundie christiannews.net

I believe that Adam and Eve were real people. I believe that God created all things ex nihilo. I believe that the Bible is full of symbols and pictures of Jesus Christ from Genesis through Revelation. I believe all the stories of the Bible in the historical accounts are literally true and are illustrations of the gospel and the coming Savior. I also believe that God can create in 7 literal 24 hour days if he wishes. After weighing good arguments on both sides, I believe that those days were long periods of time. I've always been intrigued by the probability of the rotation of the earth slowing and cooling in order to support the next level of creation. I find this absolutely stunning and beautiful. That does NOT make me an evolutionist. 14 billion years or any other time frame would never be long enough for macro evolution. If you believe in 7 literal 24 hour days, great! Let's make room for open, respectful discussion.

WestWins #fundie #homophobia christiannews.net

WestWins:
Right! This all started because they simply wanted Civil Unions. Then it was "Bake That Cake!"
That expression -- "The Camel's Nose"

Canis Vulpes:
"Bake the Cake" I understand. If you run a bakery, people will have the right to expect you will bake a cake for them.

WestWins:
Did you just crawl out from under a rock? The issue was not about the cake.

Canis Vulpes:
The customer was getting married and was homosexual, and homosexuality is legal in the state where the cake was ordered. You (and the baker) have no leg to stand on. A cake is a cake, he didn't order a special gay cake. The baker caters to the public, not his church's bake sale.

WestWins:
Unbelievable. Go to a different Baker!!!
Hey Communist China is accepting members. I'll buy you a plane ticket

Canis Vulpes:
When a shopkeeper slaps you across the face, you don't go to a different one. You expose his bigotry and force him to obey the law. We aren't governed by your church, much as I'm sure you wish we were.
Plus look at the Pandora's box you open when you do that. If Christian bigots get to suddenly say who they are too high and mighty to serve, it can turn around and bite you back pretty hard. I know a ton of people who grit their teeth at the thought of associating with white supremacists. But you serve the public as a whole and get on with it.

WestWins:
"......and force him to obey the law...…."
Yep. Thanks.. I hear you loud and clear!

Canis Vulpes:
The law isn't optional. Are you suggesting it is?

WestWins:
Which Law? Laws change all the time.

Canis Vulpes:
I see, and you want to give shopkeepers the right to deny their services to the general public if they are Christians and don’t like the things their customers do in private?

WestWins:
It's called FREEDOM. What this Nation was Founded on until the CockRoaches infiltrated and destroyed her.

Canis Vulpes:
It is the opposite of freedom if you are the homosexual customer. But you don’t care about their side, do you? I bet you’d be the first one to scream if it was Christians being told to shop elsewhere.

WestWins:
Why do you care ……………… your side is winning!!! Good grief. Get an inch, take a mile.
Ironic -- someday soon what you 'suggest' will happen. And you are the one whom will have no sympathy for the Christian and the Posterity. It's happening right before our very eyes.
Bolshevik Russia -- Coming to America!

AlwaysPursueTruth #fundie christiannews.net

Because only the bible has the power of prophecy fulfilled throughout
history to back it up as true. These other "religions" do not.
In
fact following God is not a religion,religion is a man made thing... And
because these false ones are created, it paints an idea that there is
no right choice, since there are many, none of them could possibly be
true.
But if you actually learn, you would see the truth for yourself.

afchief #fundie christiannews.net

What Islam Isn't

By Dr. Peter Hammond
FrontPageMagazine. com | Monday, April 21, 2008

The following is adapted from Dr. Peter Hammonds book: Slavery, Terrorism and Islam: The Historical Roots and Contemporary Threat: Islam is not a religion nor is it a cult. It is a complete system. Islam has religious, legal, political, economic and military components. The religious component is a beard for all the other components. Islamization occurs when there are sufficient Muslims in a country to agitate for their so-called religious rights.

When politically correct and culturally diverse societies agree to the reasonable Muslim demands for their religious rights, they also get the other components under the table. Heres how it works (percentages source CIA: The World Fact Book (2007)).

As long as the Muslim population remains around 1% of any given country they will be regarded as a peace-loving minority and not as a threat to anyone. In fact, they may be featured in articles and films, stereotyped for their colorful uniqueness:

United States Muslim 1.0%
Australia Muslim 1.5%
Canada Muslim 1.9%
China Muslim 1%-2%
Italy Muslim 1.5%
Norway Muslim 1.8%

At 2% and 3% they begin to proselytize from other ethnic minorities and disaffected groups with major recruiting from the jails and among street gangs:

Denmark Muslim 2%
Germany Muslim 3.7%
United Kingdom Muslim 2.7%
Spain Muslim 4%
Thailand Muslim 4.6%

From 5% on they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population.

They will push for the introduction of halal (clean by Islamic standards) food, thereby securing food preparation jobs for Muslims. They will increase pressure on supermarket chains to feature it on their shelves along with threats for failure to comply. (United States ).

France Muslim 8%
Philippines Muslim 5%
Sweden Muslim 5%
Switzerland Muslim 4.3%
The Netherlands Muslim 5.5%
Trinidad &Tobago Muslim 5.8%

At this point, they will work to get the ruling government to allow them to rule themselves under Sharia, the Islamic Law. The ultimate goal of Islam is not to convert the world but to establish Sharia law over the entire world.

When Muslims reach 10% of the population, they will increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions ( Paris car-burnings) . Any non-Muslim action that offends Islam will result in uprisings and threats ( Amsterdam Mohammed cartoons).

Guyana Muslim 10%
India Muslim 13.4%
Israel Muslim 16%
Kenya Muslim 10%
Russia Muslim 10-15%

After reaching 20% expect hair-trigger rioting, jihad militia formations, sporadic killings and church and synagogue burning:

Ethiopia Muslim 32.8%

At 40% you will find widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks and ongoing militia warfare:

Bosnia Muslim 40%
Chad Muslim 53.1%
Lebanon Muslim 59.7%

From 60% you may expect unfettered persecution of non-believers and other religions, sporadic ethnic cleansing (genocide), use of Sharia Law as a weapon and Jizya, the tax placed on infidels:

Albania Muslim 70%
Malaysia Muslim 60.4%
Qatar Muslim 77.5%
Sudan Muslim 70%

After 80% expect State run ethnic cleansing and genocide:

Bangladesh Muslim 83%
Egypt Muslim 90%
Gaza Muslim 98.7%
Indonesia Muslim 86.1%
Iran Muslim 98%
Iraq Muslim 97%
Jordan Muslim 92%
Morocco Muslim 98.7%
Pakistan Muslim 97%
Palestine Muslim 99%
Syria Muslim 90%
Tajikistan Muslim 90%
Turkey Muslim 99.8%
United Arab Emirates Muslim 96%

100% will usher in the peace of Dar-es-Salaam the Islamic House of Peace theres supposed to be peace because everybody is a Muslim:

Afghanistan Muslim 100%
Saudi Arabia Muslim 100%
Somalia Muslim 100%
Yemen Muslim 99.9%

Of course, thats not the case. To satisfy their blood lust, Muslims then start killing each other for a variety of reasons.

Before I was nine I had learned the basic canon of Arab life. It was me against my brother; me and my brother against our father; my family against my cousins and the clan; the clan against the tribe; and the tribe against the world and all of us against the infidel. Leon Uris, The Haj

It is good to remember that in many, many countries, such as France, the Muslim populations are centered around ghettos based on their ethnicity. Muslims do not integrate into the community at large. Therefore, they exercise more power than their national average would indicate.

Final thought.

In the Bible, God prophesied that Ishmael and his descendants would be wild and fight with everyone. This prediction has held true throughout history. Will the world ever have peace with Ishmael? Will Ishmael even find peace himself? Deep down, dont we all want the same things (love, peace, acceptance)? I wonder how much longer we will have to wait before real peace comes to humanity.

TruthvLies #fundie christiannews.net

One. Christian numbers are not dropping. They are increasing by the day. In China it is something like 10,000 day. In India it is thousands. In the Middle East muslims are converting to christianity in droves because Jesus is appearing to them in dreams and visions.

I know that you want their numbers to be dropping but it ain't the case. Even in America, over the last fifty years the numbers have remained constant.

I don't know what religion does as I am not involved in it. My faith is based on a relationship with a person so I don't need religion.
Sorry to say for you, I don't have an ego as I am dead and my life is hid with Christ in God.

Pascal's wager is only a poor argument if you are on the wrong end of it which atheists are. If it is true and it is, then you are a complete fool to say it is a poor argument.

But then atheist specialise in denial to avoid the truth.

Richard #fundie christiannews.net

The problem with the FSM, Leprechaun, and Odin questions is that they all start with an incorrect premise. They equate these imaginary and fictional characters to a real historical being. This is a mistake in logic and reason. This is why atheists often find themselves running in circles trying to figure out why their ‘argument’ is silly.

The reality of God is already established as a matter of the historical record. To believe God isn’t real, requires them to disprove the already established facts about God—which all of them admit they can’t do.

Because they can’t do it, their entire belief that God isn’t real – even though God has already been established as real – is based on blind faith—a belief (opinion) but not facts and evidence.

This is why it takes great faith to be an atheist.

Jason Todd #fundie christiannews.net

Sisyphus:
Evolution is based in science, intelligent design is an attempt to make superstition sound like science.

Jason Todd:
Evolution is a theory. And the idea of humans evolving from monkeys is part of it.
The problem with evolution is simple: Why, if we evolved from monkeys, do monkeys co-exist?

Sisyphus:
Firstly, you are using the term "theory" but mean "hypothesis", they are not the same thing. Humans have a common ancestor with modern apes, but, as I said previously, no credible scientist would contend humans evolved from monkeys.

Jason Todd:
No, I mean theory. Evolution is merely a guess, ruined by your own admission that we didn't evolve from monkeys. Intelligent design merely suggests a creator. This makes sense because the idea everything came from nothing is logically absurd.

Sisyphus:
How can you discuss anything related to science without even understanding the terms and concepts? Try learning the difference between theory versus a hypothesis. Hypothesis = a guess explaining observable phenomena & theory = a tested model to explain a proven set of factors. What you explain regarding evolution is a hypothesis, and evolution is a scientific model of facts.

Jason Todd:
Science always changes. God never does. Why can't you grasp that concept?

Jim Oakley #fundie christiannews.net

I've heard all this ignorance a hundred times no doubt over the years and am no closer to believing it now than I was the first time. In other words, you are wasting your time when you preach the nonsense you peddle.

The fact is, I have a Spiritual mind and understand things that your carnal mind can never comprehend. No, I'm not trying to sound superior or better than you. Actually my mind is better because it has been changed by God Himself and He has enabled me and other born again Christians to see from His perspective.

The carnal mind is ruled by Satan whose goal is to keep people in darkness and ignorance.

Man is no part ape, never has been. It is two different kinds of flesh. The flesh of man is unique among all the flesh in the world and was purposely designed to be so.

Wise folks take to heart the following words lest they be shown to be foolish in the end.

"But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body. 39All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds." ~ 1 Corinthians 15:38-39

Reason2012 #fundie christiannews.net

(1) There is no such thing as "separation of church and state" in the Constitution. That phrase came from the time a Pastor wrote a letter to Jefferson expressing his fears that Jefferson would in some way restrict religious freedoms. In response to these fears, Thomas Jefferson wrote a letter back to indicate that he would in no way restrict the freedom of religious expression because he saw a wall of separation between church and state.

So actually the phrase means the exact opposite of what a few claim it means: it re-iterates the First Amendment, that government shall make no laws prohibiting the free exercise of religious expression.

(2) First Amendment: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; And yet those who reject God demand the government establish its own denomination of Christianity with its own version of marriage. A violation of the First Amendment.

(3) Congress/government also cannnot make a law prohibiting the free exercise thereof.

A school can decide to, for example, put up Ten Commandment displays and no one can force them not to.

A school can decide NOT to put up Ten Commandment displays and no one can force them to.

But in a Christian nation, the populace will be personally choosing to put up Ten Commandment displays often. Those that do not like this can start voting in a large number of people that believe differently and hope it changes.

That's liberty.

That's freedom.

That's the Constitution many died to create.

That's the United States of America.

Start understanding the Constitution, the First Amendment and the lie about "separation to church and state" and take back our right to honor and worship God as people in positions of leadership personally choose and see fit to on a case by case basis. America is under attack by those who hate Christians and Christianity, seeking to eventually ban it from everywhere except in your church, and after that who knows. We need to get back to the truth of God!

2 Chronicles 7:14 "If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land."

cadcoke5 #homophobia christiannews.net

There is valid reason to have more concern over a homosexual worker. Less than 3% of American men say they are homosexual, but nearly 1/3 of child sexual molesters are homosexual. Furthermore, you can see support for these acts from major homosexual leaders, and publications. This open support has reduced a lot in recent years, and NAMBLA is no longer permitted to march in the Gay parades. But, there remains an undercurrent that is OK with, or at least down-plays these crimes.

Harry Oh! #fundie christiannews.net

It's ok for Obama to publicly reject the DOMA, while it was still a law, but apparently this clerk doesn't have enough clout to reject a law that offends her and millions of others. This is the absolute height of hypocrisy. The laws in this country are a joke and have become more of a 'suggestion' to be enforced or rejected based on the whims and flavour of the current culture.

Amos Moses #homophobia christiannews.net

(Commenting on story "Children's Cartoon 'Drag Tots' to Feature ‘Baby Drag Queens’ Voiced by Cast of ‘RuPaul’s Drag Race’"):

and the TIDAL WAVE of depravity continues to flow in ...... gotta have them kids GROOMED ..... to make way for the legalization of Pedophilia ............. and all those who want to say no one wants to legalize that ..... all you have to do is look at 80s and 90s and 2000s TV to see how we were inundated with homosexual characters and that agenda so they could finally deceive everyone into homomirage into this country ..... the PIT of depravity has no bottom .........

Amos Moses #homophobia christiannews.net

(commenting on story "Parents Speak Out After ‘Drag Queen’ Included Among Literacy Day Speakers at Middle School")

Amos Moses:
THERE IT IS ...... they cant just keep it in the library and in their private lives and in their pants ..... they have to display it ... not just to children in the library ..... but to children eveywhere ...... and the PRIDE of homoMIRAGE keeps paying dividends for the depraved of mind, soul, and spirit ........... this is rank pedophilic grooming ..... it has been the goal all along ...........

finian:
No...just no, there is absolutely no mention of gay marriage in this story whatsoever. This story is about drag queens. Focus your outrage in the correct place please.

Amos Moses:
so what ...... it is the same depravity of mind, soul, and spirit .......... you should focus on your own depravity instead of making excuses for others .......

Amos Moses #homophobia christiannews.net

the pedophilia is getting more organized ..... more overt .... more in your face every day ..... and it is all because of the HOMOMIRAGE decision ......... when you remove restraint on any depravity .... it releases ALL DEPRAVITY to forge ahead ..... and they are doing so with gusto ..... and there is no fear of God before their eyes .... and they have given up any knowledge of anything as a result ..... this is child abuse and it is grooming to be abused ..... these "parents" will have much to answer for .......

Amos Moses #fundie #homophobia christiannews.net

Amos Moses:
"And christian... btw
one was a preacher"

ummmm ..... no they were not... and no he was not ........... despite the label ........

Throatwobbler Mangrove:
No True Scotsman fallacy

Amos Moses:
does not apply to christianity ............ FAIL ...........

Throatwobbler Mangrove:
Absolutely applies to Christianity. Actually, to exclusionary Christians.

Amos Moses:
nope ... sorry .... christianity is not a "logic" problem ..... and while God is COMPLETELY and EMINENTLY logical ...... your only fallacy is that you try to apply that fallacy to christianity ..... christianity is specifically EXCLUDED because of what christianity is .... so all homosexuals are pedophiles .... right ....

Throatwobbler Mangrove:
No, sorry. There is nothing "magic" about Christianity that would exempt it from the No True Scotsman fallacy, given that the fallacy itself is based on simple reasoning.

Amos Moses:
nope ... FAIL .... NTS does not apply ........

Throatwobbler Mangrove:
No, that's nonsense. The internet is littered with Christian examples. And in fact telling someone else they're a false Christian is about the best example there is.

Amos Moses:
NTS is an application to a logic problem .... FAIL .... christianity is not a logic problem .... FAIL again .... the only problem you have is christianity is not logical to you .... because you do not understand it ..... you can litter wherever you please .... but that trash does not float here ..... so again ... all homosexuals are PEDOPHILES ... right ......

Throatwobbler Mangrove:
I don't know what "all homosexuals are pedophiles" is except a lie, but it's certainly not an example of No True Scotsman. It's not a logic problem, it's a logical fallacy when you try to discredit someone else when they don't follow the same belief in the exact same way you do. You're guilty of it all right.

Amos Moses:
"I don't know what "all homosexuals are pedophiles" is except a lie"
so No True Homosexual is a pedophile .... hmmmm ... shoe on other foot i see ........

Throatwobbler Mangrove:
That makes no sense, and isn't an example of No True Scotsman.
Here's an example you should be able to understand, and helpfully includes a Christian example similar to the one you've been using:
"The example this fallacy is named for goes like this: one Scotsman declares that no Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge. Another points out that he's a Scotsman, and he puts sugar on his porridge. To that, the first replies that no true Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge. The problem here is that whether or not those who put sugar on their porridge are "true" Scotsmen is a subjective claim, or just a statement of opinion. Opinions are weak evidence for an argument. The porridge example is a trivial one, but this fallacy shows up in all sorts of sinister ways. Often, it's used to exclude people from a group. How often have you heard that someone isn't a real man, a real American, or a true Christian for a "distasteful" quality they have or action they've taken?"

Amos Moses:
thats why it does not apply to christianity ....

Throatwobbler Mangrove:
Right, here's another random internet example of how it applies perfectly to Christianity.

https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/135/No-True-Scotsman

"In 2011, Christian broadcaster, Harold Camping, (once again) predicted the end of the world via Jesus, and managed to get many Christians to join his alarmist campaign. During this time, and especially after the Armageddon date had passed, many Christian groups publicly declared that Camping is not a “true Christian”. On a personal note, I think Camping was and is as much of a Christian as any other self-proclaimed Christian and religious/political/ethical beliefs aside, I admire him for having the cojones to make a falsifiable claim about his religious beliefs."

Amos Moses:
yeah ... proves nothing .... Camping was not acting in line with scripture and it was not the first time ..... so what .... christians decide who is a christian and who is not .... the christian is authorized by scripture to do so ... that nullifies any NTS .... and NTS applies to logical matters not spiritual matters .... misapplication of your "fallacy" is your problem ... not ours ........ FAIL ............

Reason2012 #fundie #homophobia christiannews.net

There's no such thing as homosexuals – only people who currently enjoy homosexuality. And adults continue to permanently turn away from homosexuality, even after decades of believing the lie they were “born that way”, proving it’s not genetic, but the product of indoctrination, confusion, mental instability and/or abuse.

And this is what God says about sin and specifically homosexuality:

Romans 1:26-27 ”For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: (27) And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their_lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.”

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 ”Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate [men who willingly take on the part of a “woman” with another man], nor abusers of themselves with mankind [sodomites], (10) Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.”

1 Timothy 1:9-10 ”Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, (10) For_whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind [s odomites], for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;”

Jude 1:7 ”Even as_Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.”

Luke 17:29 ”[Jesus said] But the same day that Lot went out of_Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.”

Matthew 19:4-6 ”And he [Jesus] answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, (5) And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? (6) Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.”

Jesus made it quite clear God made us male and female so that a man will leave his father and mother (not two fathers, not three mothers and so on) and cleave onto his wife (not his husband and so on).

The Word of God rebukes us all – even if we all try to say we don’t believe the Bible, the very Word of God will be our judge when we face Him. And God is a righteous judge and will judge us all – not turn a blind eye to our sin. Do not be deceived by the world: it’s God we will have to convince that His word was a lie, not men. What happened in Noah’s day when the entire world rejected God? Did God spare them because there were so many? No – they all perished except for Noah and his family!

Proverbs 9:10 ”The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.”

God spared not His chosen people – we are kidding ourselves if we think He will spare the United States of America if we choose to blatantly turn away from Him.

Jeremiah 12:17 ”But if they will not obey, I will utterly pluck up and destroy that nation, saith the LORD.”

Genesis 19:7-9 "And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly. (8) Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof. (9) And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door."

Luke 17:28-30 "So also as it was in the days of Lot: they ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built; (29) but the day Lot went out of Sodom, it rained fire and brimstone from the heaven and destroyed them all. (30) Even so it shall be in the day when the Son of Man is revealed."

Romans 1:18-32 "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold [suppress] the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them."

The entire Bible points out men having_sex with men is an abomination. Likewise woman having_sex with women. It's not just Paul that pointed it out.

Genesis 19:4-13 "But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter: And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them [men wanting to have_sex with men].

And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him, And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly. Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing [he offers his daughters to be raped to keep them from having_sex with another man - shows rape is not the issue but male on male_sex]; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door. But the men put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house to them, and shut to the door. And they smote the men that were at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that they wearied themselves to find the door.

And the men said unto Lot, Hast thou here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place: For we will destroy this place, because the cry of them is waxen great before the face of the LORD; and the LORD hath sent us to destroy it."

Leviticus 18:22 "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination."

Leviticus 20:13 "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

Even cross-dressing is an abomination:

Deuteronomy 22:5 "The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God."

Deuteronomy 23:17 "There shall be no_whore of the daughters of Israel, nor a sodomite of the sons of Israel."

1 Kings 22:46 "And the remnant of the sodomites, which remained in the days of his father Asa, he took out of the land."

1 Kings 15:11-12 "And Asa did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD, as did David his father. And he took away the sodomites out of the land, and removed all the idols that his fathers had made."

2 Kings 23:7 "And he brake down the houses of the sodomites, that were by the house of the LORD, where the women wove hangings for the grove."

Ezekiel 16:49-50 "Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy. And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good."

And the "pride" parades about homosexuality are more of the same.

Matthew 19:4-5 "And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?"

Not father and father. Not mother and mother. Not his husband. And only two people off opposite gender can become "one flesh".

May God/Jesus Christ be glorified!

Amos Moses #fundie #homophobia christiannews.net

(commenting on story "UK Humanists Want Homosexual Issues Taught in Primary Schools")

A humanist campaign group wants four-year-olds to be taught about LGBT issues, and has branded religious views on sexuality “discriminatory.”
Humanists UK, formerly known as the British Humanist Association, issued a statement backing government plans on new primary school relationships education.
Under the proposals, children will be taught about “different types of relationships,” which critics fear could include homosexuality, transsexualism and same-sex marriage.
The group went on to compare traditional religious views to racism, claiming they were an “unconscionable affront to the equality and dignity of all people.”

Amos Moses:
Pedophilia.............

glenbo:
How is teaching acceptance of those who are different "pedophilia?"
How is teaching diversity "pedophilia?"
By your "logic," teaching kids to accept black kids in their schools as equal is racism.

Amos Moses:
conflation of race and depravity is a false paradigm ..... and there is no "logic" there ..........
sexualization and grooming of children to accept that sexualization ...... is pedophilia ...........

glenbo:
Define sexualization.

Amos Moses:
Grooming or making CHILDREN view and accept sex (especially depraved sex) as part of their "education" ............ it includes numerous activities ............

Sally Edwards:
No, pedophilia is actively sexually abusing a child.
No one is grooming children for pedophilia by teaching them that some people are homosexuals. Pedophilia wasn't mentioned in the article.

Amos Moses:
no it is not ...........LIE .............
"Pedophilia is termed pedophilic disorder in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5), and the manual defines it as a paraphilia involving intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children that have either been acted upon or which cause the person with the attraction distress or interpersonal difficulty. [1] The International Classification of Diseases (ICD-10) defines it as a sexual preference for children of prepubertal or early pubertal age.[4]"
GROOMING is what is being done to CHILDREN to accept homosexuality ............ and it is pedophilia ......

Sally Edwards:
"Intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children"
Your words, not mine. Now tell me that relates to this simple story about a school educating children about homosexuals.
Also, homosexuality and pedophilia could not be more different.

Amos Moses:
NOPE .... DSM-5s words .......... FAIL .... TRY AGAIN .............

NIGELTEAPOT #fundie christiannews.net

sodomy is the second worst sin that cries to Heaven for vengeance and is only allowed by God when a civilization becomes so abhorrent that He marks it for death.

it directly causes the collapse of any group and spreads disease that cannot be cured.

the second worst satanic ritual of all is pretending to "marry" two men or two women to mock the second-most important Sacrament of Marriage. this is so evil that it directly caused the deluge.

you will know this eternally.

Amos Moses #wingnut #homophobia christiannews.net

(commenting on story "UK Syphilis Cases Up 20 Percent in One Year"):

Amos Moses:
Gee ..... this is REALLY OLD data ..... it is over 10 days old ...... how can we trust this data ...... and its "mostly-obviously-biased sources " ...... but you know ..... none of these cases had anything to do with "monogamous homosexual partners" and we know that all "married" homosexuals are monogamous ...... and shyphlis and gonorrhoea ........ they do not effect society and the families of these monogamous homosexual MSM partners ............... /////SARC OFF .................

HarmNoOne:
well obviously none of the cases have to do with monogamous partners, you dont catch stds if you are monogamous and that goes for gay or straight

Amos Moses:
The myth is that homosexuals were ever monogamous ...........

HarmNoOne:
some are and some are not, just like heteros

Amos Moses:
MYTH ........

HarmNoOne:
google gay men and monogamy and report back to me

Amos Moses:
Comparing the Lifestyles of Homosexual Couples to Married Couples
by: Timothy J. Dailey, Ph. D.
(article removed)

HarmNoOne:
timothy dailey is a widely debunked idiot. opinion pieces mean nothing and this article STILL doesn't say there are no gay monogamous couples. why are you trying to hard to prove something impossible?

Amos Moses:
right ... a scientific study you do not want to agree with as it leaves you butt hurt with the facts .......

HarmNoOne:
his study doesnt say there are no monogamous gay couples. read it again

Amos Moses:
it says what YOU want to call monogamy ..... and what homosexuals call monogamy ...... and what monogamy REALLY is ......... is not what homosexuals are portraying it to be ..... they are lying through obfuscation, sophistry, and casuistry ......... and a lie is still just a lie .....

HarmNoOne:
nice try. you cant say that his words really mean something other than what they say. youre making a crazy unsupportable statement when you say there is no such thing as a faithful gay or lesbian couple especially when there are millions of examples online that shoot your pathetic lie down.

Amos Moses:
there is no evidence ..... length of time spent together is not evidence of monogamy .....

HarmNoOne:
in that case you cant prove that anyone is monogamous and faithful. gay or straight

FoJC_Forever #fundie #homophobia christiannews.net

The mercy of God never deviates from the Truth. It is Love that compels the followers of Jesus (the) Christ to tell homosexuals that their sin is killing them and keeping them separated from God. It's not just homosexuality, but since society is magnifying this sin so much, it behooves all Christians to address it directly. God will save someone enslaved by homosexuality just like He will save someone who is enslaved by any other sin. The Truth is that homosexuality isn't the only sin that homosexuals struggle with, it's just the one on the front page right now. $$$.

The homosexual movement is just one of many movements in the earth being propagated by demons as they move the world toward the acceptance of the Antichrist. People are inundated with sexually charged material every day. "Sex sells" is the motto and homosexuality is selling as well. Demons know how to manipulate people through Sin, and they are using this current movement to manipulate governments, religious institutions, schools, families, and entire subsets of human social culture.

Don't forget the quote Gianna Jessen spoke before Congress. Hitler didn't come up with this idea, he just used it to manipulate his people and country. Advertisers in America use the same tactic every day to sell their products and services. Politicians in America use it when they run for office. The falsely religious use the same tactic to draw people into their false doctrines. Demons use it every day to manipulate the nations of the world.

God isn't concerned about us celebrating the rainbow. God wants us to celebrate and receive the Salvation brought to us through Jesus (the) Christ.

Roger Marks #homophobia christiannews.net

Sexual orientation doesn't determine one's qualifications to be a parent.

All the research I have done clearly indicates that ones sexual orientation has a very clear indication about the qualification for being a parent.

The research shows that a child does best when raise by a male and a female, preferable their own parents.

A series of videos made interviewing children raised by homosexuals when they had reached the age of 21 and they not needing their parents present showed quite clearly that being raised by homosexuals was as they said "hell."

A progamme I saw on TV and backed up by other research showed that most homosexual couples have sex on the side with other men.

Research shows that per head of population there is more violence amongst homosexual couples than amongst heterosexual ones.

Research shows that the average length of homosexual relationships is two years.

In every case of homosexuals wanting to adopt children, the major factor was the homosexuals wanting to be made happy by the child.

All of these facts combined shows that homosexual parenting is not fair on the children and should be avoided.

Amos Moses #homophobia christiannews.net

Tangent002:
Cases of people claiming to have been "cured" of homosexuality are anecdotal only. There has never been a single medically documented case of a fully-homosexual person being "turned" fully-heterosexual.

The vast majority of anecdotes I have read are folks given strategies to ignore their same-sex attraction and live lives of celibacy.

Amos Moses:
"There has never been a single medically documented case of a fully-homosexual person ......... "

if you had stopped there it would have been the truth ...............

Ambulance Chaser:
False. "A difference in hypothalamic structure between heterosexual and homosexual men," Science, 1991.

Amos Moses:
"LeVay's finding was widely reported in the media. LeVay openly related his research to his own homosexuality and to his mourning over his lover's death from AIDS."

again .... more pseudo-science and bias ..... looked at a Rorschach and saw what he wanted to see to justify himself and his sin ...... more baloney ..........

Ambulance Chaser:
You said it wasn't reported in medical journals. It was.

(Also, is be remiss if I didn't point out that nothing you wrote discredits the findings.)

Amos Moses:
"You said it wasn't reported in medical journals. "

WHERE .............. FYI ..... Science magazine .... IS NOT a medical journal .....

FYI .... BIASED findings are ALREADY discredited ............. ON THEIR FACE ....... Prima facie evidence of falsity is BIAS ......... that makes any assertion of science FALSE ...... "i have my conclusion .... now let me see if i can manufacture evidence to prove it" ..... NOT SCIENCE ...

Ambulance Chaser:
Right, except LeVay didn't do that and you have no evidence that he did. All you know is that he's gay and his partner died. That's ALL.

Jane Goodall likes chimps. She has an affinity for them. Does that mean that all her research is therefore null and void?

Amos Moses:
J Scott Armstrong: Fewer Than 1 Percent Of Papers in Scientific Journals Follow Scientific Method

todays story ........... sorry charlie ..... all you have is PSEUDO-SCIENCE ..................

Ambulance Chaser:
A) That's not what Armstrong's paper concluded. It's actually a lot more complicated than that.
B) Armstrong says nothing about this study. How do you know it's not one of the 1%?
C) Why should I believe Armstrong at all? You don't trust things published in scientific journals.

"his open PUBLIC admission is enough to discredit his findings ...
i.e. ....."LeVay openly related his research to his own homosexuality and to his mourning over his lover's death from AIDS."

No, it isn't, because nothing about being gay has anything to do with whether your findings are correct. YOU'RE biased. Can I summarily dismiss everything you say? If a research oncologist has cancer, do his findings automatically become wrong? If a Christian theologian writes a treatise about the Bible, is everything he says immediately wrong?

Amos Moses:
"Armstrong says nothing about this study. How do you know it's not one of the 1%?"

but there are NUMEROUS other studies of science journals ...... and i did not say it included this study ..... but this study is flawed from inception for the reasons i have cited ...... believe what you want to believe ..... you do anyway ......

Ambulance Chaser:
Yes, is it flawed? How? Be specific. Cite page numbers.

Don't tell me "because the author is gay." Do the work.

Shouting "bias" is an irrelevant ad hominem. I've explained why but you chose to ignore me.

Amos Moses:
"Be specific. Cite page numbers."

starts at the beginning and goes until the end ..... the ENTIRE study is BIASED and FLAWED by the authors PUBLIC ADMISSION of WHY he did the study and the BASIS of his bias ............. how hard is that to understand ..........

i do not expect a study on slavery to be against slavery by a slave owner ..... it is a pointless exercise ....... why do you think the standard changes for homosexuals trying to prove the benefits or whatever of being a homosexual with science ...... it is equally pointless ..... they will see what they WANT to see and any other outcome was not even considered .....

Ambulance Chaser:
So let me get this straight: I can submit a rebuttal to ANY scientific article, on any topic, to any peer-reviewed journal in America, and all I have to write in that rebuttal is a one-sentence comment about the first author's "bias?" And that sentence will be sufficient to rebut the totality of the first article?

How do you account for the fact that approximately ZERO articles published every year follow this format?

Amos Moses:
strawman argument ...... he stated his bias PUBLICLY ........... that is sufficient to disregard his findings .....

his open PUBLIC admission is enough to discredit his findings ...

i.e. ....."LeVay openly related his research to his own homosexuality and to his mourning over his lover's death from AIDS."

Ambulance Chaser:
So you're only biased if you state it publicly?

Amos Moses:
nope ..... but he did ..........

FoJC_Forever #fundie christiannews.net

Totally awesome! Praise God for the life of Gianna Jessen! May her voice be heard across this nation and the world. Those in Heaven rejoice to see her give witness to the inhumane brutality of what many call "rights". We will see and worship God forever with those who have been murdered by "the woman's right to choose". They too will be resurrected unto Life!

Judgememt is coming.

Follow Jesus, find Salvation

afchief #fundie christiannews.net

Imagine that the Lord gave you a precious son and at 5 years old you made the decision to send him off to a public “school” where he will spend the next 13 years of his life. In this school they are taught lots of things.

• They teach him that man came from apes and that life has no real meaning.
• They teach him that the mention of God was illegal.
• They teach him that there are many types of families and that they were all healthy.
• They teach him that he was to accept all types of behaviors as normal.
• They teach him not to judge other’s because there is no such thing as right and wrong.
• They teach him that every type of behavior was normal but some needed “protection.”

What if they told you your precious son was going to be included in a classroom with 20 other students, collected from around your community. Your son would spend 7 hours a day hanging out with these children yet:

• You knew very little about any of the other children.
• You didn’t know what kind of home life they came from.
• You didn’t know if any of them were on any types of “medication.”
• You knew nothing about the “behavior issues” some were dealing with.
• You knew nothing about what they did in their spare time.
• You knew nothing about their moral compass.

While they were at the school you felt confident leaving them with the “teachers” even though:

• You knew very little about the teachers’ personal beliefs.
• You knew very little about the teachers’ personal lifestyle.
• You knew very little about the personal stress the teacher was under.
• You knew very little about what was actually being taught.
• You knew very little about the condition of “others” in the teachers’ life.
• You knew very little about what the teacher viewed in his/her private time.

Imagine that:

• Everyone in town knew where there were a bunch of little kids.
• No weapons were on sight to protect them from an intruder and everyone knew it.
. You forfeited your parental rights when the child walked into the school door.
• Educational “experts” were permitted to do psychological studies on your child.
• Non-medical experts were permitted to recommend “medication” to control behavior.
• A child’s expression of religious beliefs was discouraged, and deviancy was accepted.

Charles #fundie #homophobia #biphobia christiannews.net

Here's some actual truth as opposed to your propaganda.

The Numbers

New HIV Infectionsb

• In 2010, gay and bisexual men accounted for 63% of estimated new HIV infections in the United States and 78% of infections among all newly infected men. From 2008 to 2010, new HIV infections increased 22% among young (aged 13-24) gay and bisexual men and 12% among gay and bisexual men overall.

• Among all gay and bisexual men, white gay and bisexual men accounted for 11,200 (38%) estimated new HIV infections in 2010. The largest number of new infections among white gay and bisexual men (3,300; 29%) occurred in those aged 25 to 34.

• Among all gay and bisexual men, black/African American gay and bisexual men accounted for 10,600 (36%) estimated new HIV infections in 2010. The largest number of new infections among black/African American gay and bisexual men (4,800; 45%) occurred in those aged 13 to 24. From 2008 to 2010 new infections increased 20% among young black/African American gay and bisexual men aged 13 to 24.

• Among all gay and bisexual men, Hispanic/Latino gay and bisexual men accounted for 6,700 (22%) estimated new HIV infections in 2010. The largest number of new infections among Hispanic/Latino gay and bisexual men (3,300; 39%) occurred in those aged 25 to 34.

HIV and AIDS Diagnosesc

• In 2013, in the United States, gay and bisexual men accounted for 81% (30,689) of the 37,887 estimated HIV diagnoses among all males aged 13 years and older and 65% of the 47,352 estimated diagnoses among all persons receiving an HIV diagnosis that year.

• In 2013, gay and bisexual men accounted for 55% of the estimated number of persons diagnosed with AIDS among all adults and adolescents in the United States. Of the estimated 14,611 gay and bisexual men diagnosed with AIDS, 40% were blacks/African Americans; 32% were whites; and 23% were Hispanics/Latinos.

• By the end of 2011, an estimated 311,087 gay and bisexual men with AIDS had died in the United States since the beginning of the epidemic, representing 47% of all deaths of persons with AIDS.

• In 2011, CDC data showed that 80.6% of MSM with diagnosed HIV infection were linked to care, 57.5% were retained in care, 52.9% were prescribed antiretroviral therapy (ART), and 44.6% had achieved viral suppression.

Sounds much more like a Homosexual issue than a Heterosexual one.. Remember the Homosexual population isn't more than 2 percent.

FoJC_Forever #homophobia #fundie christiannews.net

Homosexuality is about perverted sex, not Love. The recent SCOTUS ruling has emboldened the Wicked to become even more aggressive. Homosexuality is a top tier sin of sexual lust.

Don't expect fair treatment from law enforcement that supports and practices this sin. The hatred that boils within them will drive them to many extremes.

Judgement is coming.

Amos Moses #wingnut #homophobia christiannews.net

[The Texas Supreme Court has ruled that same-sex marriages are not entitled to the same governmental benefits as opposite-sex marriages.]

SFBruce:
Since the Obergefell decision is based on the guarantee of equal protection under the law, it's not hard to understand that SCOTUS did, indeed, intend for same sex marriages to be treated exactly as opposite sex marriages, including all the rights and responsibilities. I hope this is taken to federal court, where I think Pidgeon and Hicks are likely to prevail.

Amos Moses:
no one was denied any equal protection ..... so that is a lie ..... any male regardless of his proclivities could marry any person of the opposite sex ..... and nothing else was ever promised by the law ............ fallacious argument ..........

Ambulance Chaser:
Of course there's an equal protection violation. You're just ignoring the two groups being treated unequally. It's not about who can marry who; that issue has been decided for two years (spoiler: it does violate EP to offer marriage to opposite sex couples but not same sex couples.)

The issue here is, now that same sex couples can get married, do those marriages have to confer the same governmental benefits as opposite sex marriages? Since the Texas Supreme Court has apparently never heard of Brown v. Board of Education, they ruled that the answer is "no" and that "separate but unequal" is just fine.

Amos Moses:
"it does violate EP to offer marriage to opposite sex couples but not same sex couples"

its not a violation if it applies equally .......... fail .... and you are spreading more lies ..........

Ambulance Chaser:
Dude, I've already told you...that part is settled law and is NOT what this article is about.

Amos Moses:
sure .... settled ... until it is NOT settled ..... as i have TOLD YOU ............

Ambulance Chaser:
Why do you keep changing the subject? Are you going to defend your comments or not?

Amos Moses:
you made the claim of "settled law" .... but you ... as a supposed "attorney" .............. KNOW that anything in law is NEVER settled as long as there is a client to challenge it ....... so defend your own "claim" ......... marriage was "settled law" .... no homomarriage ...... until it was not .... slavery was "settled law" ..... until it was not ....... there .... SUCCESSFULLY defended ...... care to try for some more ............

Ambulance Chaser:
"Settled law" means nothing has overturned it. Once Obergefell was handed down, it became the law, and every case that follows it has to take it into account. Courts don't rule "Well Smith v. Jones held X, but that may be overturned someday so we'll have to consider it unsettled when making this ruling..." Rulings don't work that way. Once an issue has been ruled on, THAT is the precedent lower courts follow.

Now, are we going to discuss the matter at hand, or are you going to keep throwing red herrings?

Amos Moses:
hehehehe ......... SO WHAT ........ it is settled ... UNTIL IT IS NOT ............

Ambulance Chaser:
All right, so clearly, we're not actually going to discuss this issue. You've made that abundantly clear. I give up.

Goldbeard #wingnut christiannews.net

When SCOTUS breaks our constitutional law by making law which they are not authorised to do by the constitution, then yes they too must be held accountable. They are not above the law. They in particular are most guilty and via amendment 10 need to be recalled and charged as felons and serve a life term without remission.

Royce E. Van Blaricome #wingnut christiannews.net

Sisyphys:
How was judge [Roy] Moore upholding the Constitution, by attempting to inject his pet ideology into law?

Royce E. Van Blaricome:
By doing exactly what he said. I can't say it anymore succinctly and clearly than he did. Your characterization is just a blatant admission to your blindness and bias. Has nothing to do with "pet ideology".

Sisyphys:
The laws of Alabama he is trying to uphold, have been determined to be unconstitutional.

Royce E. Van Blaricome:
By your ilk, maybe.

Ambulance Chaser:
No, by the Supreme Court, whose job it is to make final determinations of law.

Royce E. Van Blaricome:
Wrong again. The People make the final determination.

That said, you might wanna checkout the 1923 Uniform Marriage and Marriage Licensing Act and the 1971 Uniform Marriage & Divorce Act. Both state, "Marriage is a personal relationship between a man and a woman arising out of a civil contract to which the consent of the parties is essential.".

In the Obergefell Decision NEITHER of those is mentioned in the Decision at all. So SCOTUS did not find them Unconstitutional and therefore they are still on the books. So legally, that means that any marriage license issued to a couple that is not of opposite sexes is invalid.

Since SCOTUS can NOT "make" Law and they didn't address the current Law on the books, it'll be interesting to see if what would happen if a challenge is brought by Moore, AL, NC or another State. At best, they could rule that the entire Marriage Licensing Act/Uniform Marriage & Divorce Act is/are void, which would mean an immediate cessation of marriage licenses.

Then a state could pass a law stating that marriage can only be used for unions of man and woman. It would no doubt be challenged and possibly overturned by some liberal activist judge or District Court.

This might open the door for another case on SSM to be considered by SCOTUS and if something were to happen to Ginsberg or Kennedy or one of the other Liberal Activists on the Court, I'd say there's a good probability that the original dissenters and Constitutionalists like Gorsuch would revisit the issue.

It's not like it's not happened before. If Obergefell were to be overturned, it certainly would NOT be the first time.

Ambulance Chaser:
Wrong again. The People make the final determination.

No, the Constitution is the final word on all laws. And when it's ambiguous, the Courts clarify it.

That said, you might wanna checkout the 1923 Uniform Marriage and Marriage Licensing Act and the 1971 Uniform Marriage & Divorce Act. Both state, "Marriage is a personal relationship between a man and a woman arising out of a civil contract to which the consent of the parties is essential.

As with many laws that start with "uniform," the Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act isn't a law at all. It was a model that states could choose to adopt or not adopt as they saw fit. Only 8 states did: Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, Kentucky, Minnesota, Missouri, Montana and Washington. None of those states ever relied on it to limit the genders of people who were allowed to marry. The "man and woman" language was just there as a common convention of what the definition of marriage was.

I have no idea what the Uniform Marriage and Marriage Licensing Act is. The only reference I found to it was an unlinked comment on a bodybuilding forum.

In the Obergefell Decision NEITHER of those is mentioned in the Decision at all. So SCOTUS did not find them Unconstitutional and therefore they are still on the books. So legally, that means that any marriage license issued to a couple that is not of opposite sexes is invalid.

So what? Obergefell states,

"The Court, in this decision, holds same-sex couples may exercise the fundamental right to marry in all States. It follows that the Court also must hold and it now does hold that there is no lawful basis for a State to refuse to recognize a lawful same-sex marriage performed in another State on the ground of its same-sex character."

They're not required to go through every law in every state that they're striking down. Their intention is made perfectly clear.

Royce E. Van Blaricome:
What a load of gobbledeygook.

afchief #wingnut christiannews.net

TheKingOfRhye
There doesn't HAVE to be a mention of marriage in the Constitution. Again, that's what the 9th Amendment is for.

afchief
Then why did the states have marriage mentioned in their Constitutions? Why was sodomy against the law in 1986. What changed? Judges!!!!!!

It's called Judiciary Tyranny!!!

TheKingOfRhye
I'm not saying the opinions of courts don't change. I'm just saying their opinion DO carry weight, which is what you don't seem to realize.

afchief
There opinions can effect change in the form of policy. The SCOTUS cannot strike down laws.

Michael C
The Court has been striking down laws for over two hundred years.

Are you just hearing about it now?

afchief
Show me where in the Constitution the SCOTUS can strike down laws?

And I will show you where only the Legislative branch can do so!!!!

TheKingOfRhye
They can declare laws unconstitutional. You mentioned how it took a long time for schools to desegregate after Brown vs Board of Education.....as if that was a GOOD thing?

afchief
That's because it took the legislative branch (congress) to change the law.

If the SCOTUS declares a law unconstitutional it is STILL up to the legislative branch to remove or change the law. Until then, it is STILL law.

Ambulance Chaser
When did Congress pass a law that says school segregation is illegal?

afchief
Go back and do you own research!

afchief #wingnut christiannews.net

afchief
You say you are a lawyer? If so, you know you have to provide evidence to convict or to win an argument! And it has to be beyond reasonable doubt.

Show me WHERE is says case law is binding in our Constitution? Show me where the SCOTUS rulings are nothing more the "opinions". Show me where the SCOTUS can "strike down laws".

Show me!!!!

Ambulance Chaser
Fine, I'll show you (again, because you apparently missed it the first time.)

Here are 3 articles on the subject.

[Posts links to an article on when precedent is mandatory and binding by an LSU Law School professor, a guide to binding precedent and case law by Georgetown University Law School, and a U.S. Government publication on proper use of case law.]

afchief
LSU Article: Does NOT give authority to strike down laws. No where does it say otherwise!!!
Georgetown Article: NOTHING in there about Federal courts "striking down laws".
Fedral Gov't Publication: I can't even get on this website. AGAIN, there is NOTHING in there about courts striking down laws. NOTHING!!!

Here, educate yourself again.

"The power of the Court to implement its decisions is limited. For example, in the famous 1954 case Brown v. Board of Education of Topeka, the justices ruled that racial segregation (separate but equal) in public places is unconstitutional. But, it took many years for school districts to desegregate.

The Court has no means (such as an army) to force implementation. Instead, it must count on the executive and legislative branches to back its decisions. In the Civil Rights Movement, the Court led the way, but the other branches had to follow before real change could take place."

Ambulance Chaser
Here's another one, from the Christian Legal Society.

[links to an pamphlet on where to find law, including many instances of court decisions that struck down laws as unconstitutional. The publisher is a Christian-run legal organization whose purpose is to help Christians exercise their rights to pray and follow their faith.]

You'll note on page 10, it says "Federal laws include court decisions..." Later it says, "The Supreme Court’s decisions are law throughout the country."

afchief
This website is an anti-christian/freedom from religion website. Enough said!!!!!

From the website:

"The Supreme Court’s decisions are law throughout the country"

Can you show me where it says that in the Constitution?

If true, why do most states still have abortion illegal?

Why do states still have in their constitutions that marriage is between one man and one woman?

Now I see what websites you are going to. LIBERAL/ANT-CHRISTIAN!!!

ENOUGH SAID!!!

WorldGoneCrazy #homophobia #fundie christiannews.net

[Same-sex marriage should be legal because it serves no purpose to make it ILLEGAL. That's how a free country works. The people advocating for more freedom don't have to justify why more freedom is good. Freedom is the default position.]

You confuse freedom with autonomy. Based on your poor logic, I should be free to murder. Oh wait, we are free to murder: if we are having an abortion!

afchief #wingnut christiannews.net

Ambulance Chaser
I would quote Supreme Court Precedent, but you wouldn't accept that, despite the fact that I showed you three law professors and a Christian legal society's publication proving that it's law.

afchief
You have proved absolutely nothing!!! I mean NOTHING!!! I have shown you in the Constitution that the SCOTUS has NO authority to strike down laws. I have shown you the founders intent of the SCOTUS and it's role. I have shown you past presidents and their dismissal of SCOTUS opinions. I have shown you where Congress (whether federal, state or local) is the only body to make, change or remove laws (besides a direct vote of the people).

And you CALL yourself a lawyer and do not know these simple truths.
???? Like I said that law degree you have should be used for your dog to take a dump on. It is worth that little!!!!!

Ambulance Chaser
So, is it your contention that "real" lawyers go about their business NOT on the premise that court rulings are binding?

You should introduce me to one.

afchief
Then Mr. "Make believe Lawyer" show me the law!!!! Show me where laws have been removed by the SCOTUS. For example show me the state Constitution that has removed the ban on homo marriage.

SHOW ME THE LAW!!!!!!!

Ambulance Chaser
I've shown you plenty. Now it's your turn. Show me a single lawyer who thinks that court precedent is not binding.

afchief
You have shown me NOTHING!!!! This is why liberalism is such a mental disorder!!! You believe lies!!! We have all been programmed with cleverly crafted lies and propaganda. It has often been stated that if you repeat a lie often enough, it becomes the truth. Look at the phrase "separation of church and state". A lie nowhere found in the Constitution. A lie that was built upon a lie in the 1947 Everson v Board of Education opinion.

Like I said an “opinion” does not change the law. They just tell us that it does and we believe their lies. We then repeat their lies and teach them to others. The lies soon become “truth”, although it is not The Truth. I’ll say it again. Courts do not make laws. Courts do not change laws. And Courts do not remove laws.

You are just repeating lies!!! Read the history of our Founders and there intent of the SCOTUS. I have posted why the Founders believed the SCOTUS should have "little" power. Why their decisions are only opinions. Why the Legislative and Executive branch have to agree to change, make or remove laws.

Study to show yourself approved!!! Because up to now, you have NOT!!!!

Ambulance Chaser
Are you going to answer my question or not?

Do "real" lawyers practice based on the premise that court precedent is not binding?

YES OR NO?

afchief
I just answered your question above! Read!!!

Royce E. Van Blaricome #fundie #wingnut christiannews.net

Michael C:
It's not a matter of "believing" any one side over the other. Roy Moore ordered Alabama public servants to violate the U.S. Constitution.

He ordered them to violate the U.S. Constitution.

It's not even a question. He did this. He put it on paper and signed it.

Royce E. Van Blaricome:
Ah, but it is more than a question. It's a lie. Moore ordered Alabama public servants to obey the Constitution AND the AL State Constitution. Try actually reading the article and opening your ears to what he actually said too.

TheLastHonestLawyer:
No, SCOTUS found that laws forbidding same-sex marriages violates the Due Process and Equal Protection clauses of the 14th Amendment, following a pattern set in a dozen other SCOUTUS cases on marriage rights.

That's the final word. No new laws were made, rather the Supreme Court found that existing state laws could not be enforced as they were unconstitutional.

Chief Justice Moore told Alabama workers to ignore that ruling. That is wrong. He paid the price for it, and will now go down in history as the only Supreme Court justice ever to be removed from the bench *twice* for misconduct.

Royce E. Van Blaricome:
Thank you for showing that SCOTUS did not follow the Constitution but rather exercised judicial activism (at least 5 of the judges did) instead of performing their duty.

You're also wrong on that being the final word. Might wanna try reading the Constitution. The USA is NOT an oligarchy.

As to your last comment, so what? As if "history" will have any significance toward him at all. "History" reflects that a group of people shouted to Caesar about the Son of God, "Crucify Him and let His blood be on us and our children." "History" reflects that a group of people brutally scourged the Son of God almost to death and that a group of people actually murdered the Son of God by crucifixion. So?

Do you honestly think the Son of God sits in any lesser of a position than what He does because of that??? LOL

Judge Moore will likely sit in an even higher position than what He did prior because of his faithfulness. Oh yeah, it's such a terribly bad thing to stand with Christ. LOL

Get your mind off the temporal and focus on Eternity.

Michael C:
Are you being serious right now?

If a part of the Alabama state constitution violates the U.S. Constitution, it's impossible to obey both of them at the same time.

You get that, right?

Royce E. Van Blaricome:
"We, the people of the State of Alabama, in order to establish justice, insure domestic tranquility and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God, do ordain and establish the following Constitution and form of government for the State of Alabama"

The Constitution of the USA actually supports and upholds that.

You get that right?

Never mind. No need to answer that. We have all gotten it by now that you simply don't get it. Nor any other truth for that matter.

WorldGoneCrazy #homophobia christiannews.net

You are missing the point here: your argument was that because SCOTUS had ruled that same-sex marriage is legal, that we should just get over it and not fight anymore. My reply was regarding how awful that would have been for black people if abolitionists had just rolled over following the heinous Dred Scott decision and said "OK, we must just get over it and not fight anymore." Do you see?

"In same-sex marriage, there is no punished/damaged party"

The individuals themselves are damaged - diapers at 30, AIDS at 45, etc, plus tons of psychological afflictions. Children who get adopted by gay "couples" are damaged AND treated as show piece pawns, and, of course, society is damaged with respect to religious freedoms. Here is an overview supporting my assertions - using secular data:

http://winteryknight.com/2012/05/08/a-secular-case-against-same-sex-marriage/

"No one "escapes" the homosexual "lifestyle"

That is easy to refute - Joe Dallas is one example amongst many:

http://www.cbn.com/spirituallife/churchandministry/daugostine_gaygospel_dallas.aspx

The Last Trump #fundie #homophobia #wingnut christiannews.net

(regarding gay marriage ruling)

Death. At the very least, confinement at re-education & labour "camps".
Impending financial collapse and martial law will seal our fate.
Jesus promised we would suffer for His namesake.
Time for us to make due.
Watch the news much?

Yeah, you're probably right. It's not like we ever hear about terms like "debt ceiling" and "fiscal cliff" (!) on a DAILY basis from even the mainstream media.
No reason whatsoever to be concerned about living well beyond our means to the tune of $18 TRILLION DOLLARS and counting! But gays can marry! Yaaaay!

I feel sorry for you bud. You really just don't have the slightest clue about what's going on outside of gays winning the right to sodomize each other, do you, you poor misguided liberal? So many like you are just going to be completely dumbfounded and utterly devastated when the bottom falls out beneath you. You actually thought that things were getting better! How tragic.

God have mercy on you foolish and unsuspecting liberals. I wouldn't wish the kind of shock & devastating disappointment that's headed your way on even my worst enemy :(

The Last Trump #homophobia christiannews.net

I was going to say that the gay community must have just been all over GoFundMe with their hate and intolerance.
And then I read, "Administrators had been "urged" by homosexual advocates to have the campaign removed"
Nuff said. The "tolerant" strike again.
It's not enough for these hateful bigots to just destroy people.
They have to deny them any help as well.
LGBT for you. Just plain UGLY.

The Last Trump #fundie #homophobia christiannews.net

No breaking the law protecting the free exercise of religious beliefs. Never been a problem for these business owners until today. Not Christianity's fault our sick and twisted society of debauchery and depravity keeps changing the definition of marriage and the growing list of protected "classes" (blech - like sodomy is a class!). Please forgive these people for not being spineless and altering their dignified and virtuous core beliefs and traditions with the ever changing winds of political correctness! What a joke!
I'll stand with those people, thank you very much. I'd rather stand for something dignified like traditional marriage and family than fall for everything like your "in" crowd today. Enjoy!

afchief #wingnut christiannews.net

afchief:
Show me what law was struck down by the SCOTUS as unconstitutional and removed from federal law?

Ambulance Chaser:
In Obergefell, any law banning same sex marriage. In Roe, any law banning abortion outright. In Brown v. Board, any state action that allows schools to be segregated. In Griswold v. Connecticut, any law banning contraceptive use by married couples. I'm Santa Fe v. Doe, any state action in which students led a prayer in the official capacity of a school event.

Shall I go on? There are 200 years worth of cases!

afchief:
Wow! More proof that liberalism truly is a mental disorder and that you are NO lawyer!!!! Go read the state Constitutions. They STILL read (the ones that have them) that marriage is between one man and one woman!!!

Abortion is not legal anywhere in America. There is no Federal Law on the books regarding abortion. None! In 30 U.S. states abortion is illegal. In the other 20 states it is legal only with exceptions for the life or health of the mother. Access to abortions of “convenience” is illegal in all 50 states.

The rest of your statements there is NO law on the books.

AND YOU CALL YOURSELF A LAWYER??????????????????

Where did you get your law degree from? Marco Polo's dance studio for the mentally deficient?

Ambulance Chaser:
And yet, every state in the union, including those in the Sixth Circuit, are issuing marriage licenses for same sex couples. If I recall correctly, it started right after Obergefell.

Why do you suppose that happened?

afchief:
I've never seen a dumber lawyer. How many times do I need to tell you courts only render "opinions"????? You have absoutely no understanding of how law is made. NONE!!!! An “opinion” does not change the law. They just tell us that it does and we believe their lies. We then repeat their lies and teach them to others. The lies soon become “truth”, although it is not The Truth. I’ll say it again. Courts do not make laws.

Are you really this dumb?????

Oboehner #wingnut christiannews.net

Oboehner:
Again with the single case court opinions as if they are relevant to others beside the ones in that case, hmmm...

Ambulance Chaser:
That's because they are, and your obstinate refusal to accept that reality does nothing to change it.

Citing case law is LITERALLY Day 1 material in law school. Citing cases is just about as natural to a lawyer as breathing. Any lawyer who doesn't cite cases regularly and abundantly is simply not practicing law.

The position you take is not just wrong, it's fractally wrong. It demonstrates not just an ignorance of the law in this case, but an ignorance of even the most fundamental basics of how law operates.

To attempt to put this into some kind of perspective, your position is the equivalent of playing Tetris and announcing that you're the winner because you got to the top of the screen faster than anyone else. Or thinking you won a round of golf because you got the highest score.

TheLastHonestLawyer:
And to build on what Ambulance Chaser said, I was taught to look for the cases that contained numerous case citations themselves. You look for the most recent, most supported decision to bolster your case.

Oboehner:
Let's see, reality...

Article I: Legislative
Section 1 -
"ALL legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the
United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of
Representatives."

"Citing case law is LITERALLY Day 1 material in law school." Can you say the inmates are running the asylum?
Do explain how non-law is binding though, I'm all a-twitter with anticipation!

TheLastHonestLawyer:
OK, I'll use small words.

Courts do not make law.

Courts examine the law.

They use the Constitution to examine laws.

The Constitution is the highest law in our nation.

This includes the Amendments.

Laws cannot violate the Constitution.

If the judge(s) find the law violates the Constitution, they issue a ruling.

That ruling says the law cannot be enforced.

It does not remove the law from the state laws.

It just neuters it.

States can appeal this decision.

But once SCOTUS has made a decision (or refused to hear the case) it is over. The last appellate ruling stands.

So, what can the state do?

They can try to rewrite the law to address what the courts found unconstitutional.

They can push for a Constitutional Amendment.

Or they can accept that they lost and move on.

This, by the way, is the reason Roy Moore lost his seat on the Alabama Supreme Court. SCOTUS ruled that laws banning same-sex marriage were in violation of the 14th Amendment. Moore tried to order county clerks to ignore the order. His own state's review board kicked him out of office for that.

Oboehner:
OK, I'll use small words too.
Only laws are binding, court cases are not either.
Courts gave themselves the power to examine laws.
The courts examining laws is not in the Constitution.
The Constitution is the highest law in our nation.
This includes the Amendments (the Tenth as well).
Laws cannot violate the Constitution.
If the judge(s) find the law violates the Constitution, they issue a ruling, which is as pretty as Billy's kindergarten drawing on the fridge.
That ruling says the law cannot be enforced, but they have no constitutional power to say that.
The ruling is the only thing neutered.
States don't have to appeal this decision as it is unconstitutional.
But once SCOTUS has made a decision (or refused to hear the case) it is over. The last appellate ruling stands ONLY over the single case that came from a lower court.

TheKingOfRhye:
"The last appellate ruling stands ONLY over the single case that came from a lower court."

That line of thinking makes no sense to me. When the Supreme Court rules, in an appeal that is brought before them, that a law is unconstitutional, how can it only apply in a single case then? The 14th Amendment gives equal protection of the law (the existing laws, not the laws you say they supposedly create) to all citizens.

Oboehner:
And?

TheKingOfRhye
And when the court rules the law applies in a certain way in one case, because of the 14th, it applies that way to everyone else.

Oh, and judicial review is in the Constitution.

"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding."

In other words, unconstitutional laws don't apply. And if you're going to tell me next that it isn't the court's job to interpret laws...well, I'm no legal expert, but I don't understand how a court system could exist without doing that. If nothing else, they have to deal with old laws, and interpret how they would apply to situations that the people who made them would have never imagined.

Oboehner:
"And when the court rules the law applies in a certain way in one case" is ONLY relevant to that case as anything else would be a usurpation of power and unconstitutional - rendering the rest of your argument null and void. In other words, unconstitutional laws or actions don't apply.

The Last Trump #fundie #homophobia christiannews.net

(on Kim Davis continuing to refuse to issue marriage licenses to homosexual couples)

I love the fact that she refuses to back down or simply resign.
Like the LGBT community so desperately calls for.
That's right Kim! FORCE them into the uncomfortable position to impeach and fire you!
You're supposed to be living in a country that guarantees the GOD GIVEN RIGHT of religious freedom. Time for somebody to PROVE IT.
Or darn well explain why not.
And stop with all the pretending.