["You don't get to have a say in what someone else does with their body. You may not like the idea of abortion but its a womans right to control what happens to her body. Not your body, not your fucking problem."]
Not your slave - not your fucking problem.
Claiming that the slaughter of your fellow human beings isn't your concern only serves to demonstrate your apathy toward others. Would you have stood by without protest while the Nazis slaughtered the Jews? Would you have shrugged your shoulders while slave owners whipped their 'property'? People like you are why human atrocities are allowed to continue unchecked. People like me are why human atrocities are brought to an end.
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But that's the thing, Jews and slaves (nice Godwin) are people, a fetus is a potential person, with emphasis on the "potential" part.
It's ironic that cultureshit invokes Nazism and slavery, given that the former was fervently anti-abortion, and the latter is effectively what they want to resurrect, for pregnant women at least.
A woman's body isn't property, it can't be seized by eminent domain, nor control of it taken for the "public good."
If CS wants to claim the fetus is a human being with the full measure of rights that means, fine. In that case it is clearly trespassing and the woman is perfectly entitled to evict it.
It's the slave's body; not the slave-owner's.
Therefore by this analogy, the slave-owner doesn't have the right to choose what happens to the slave's body.
(David B.)
You and I may know that, but fundies don't. In their view, the "baby" isn't a trespasser, because giving consent to have sex and giving consent to become/remain pregnant are obviously one and the same. *rolls eyes*
Actually, lack of abortion leads to high birth rates, especially to women whose children are raised (or not raised) unwanted and turn to a life of crime.
Let me put this another way:
Hitler's mom considered an abortion. Her doctor told her otherwise.
Yay. Godwin and strawmen.image
Meanwhile unculturedshit shrugs his shoulders at women dying and having their lives and well being put in danger due to anti-choice dogma. He shows no apathy toward anyone. He would happily standby while women died from botched abortions and ectopic pregnancies. People like him are why these atrocities are allowed to continue unchecked. But the idea that he and his ilk will somehow "end abortions 4ever~~!!" is fucking laughable.
"Would you have stood by without protest while the Nazis slaughtered the Jews? Would you have shrugged your shoulders while slave owners whipped their 'property'?"
Surely you can't be serious? Oh, you are! (No, I wasn't calling you Shirley!)
Those Jews and those slaves weren't doing things to their own bodies! OTHERS were doing it! Not the same thing.
This is the first time I'm commenting on a quote from cultureshift. I've held my tongue so far simply because I have been waiting to see some sort of logic from this person, even a tiniest iota of some form of coherence. Now, I've read many times that cultureshift is a guy and nonreligious, so I have to ask: Why is he so rabidly prolife? I mean, "rights for the preborn" is usually the schtick of fundamentalist Christians. I just can't wrap my head around this guy's mindset...
A human being is a breathing being with an active digestive system that produces energy, who has a birth day and a belly-button.
The Nazis were about as adamant about abortions as you are, stupid!
People like you are why human atrocities continues unchecked, asshole; like desperate pregnant young women throwing themselves in front of trains or into lakes/rivers/seas. When you have made sure that every single born child is expected, wanted, cared for, fed and loved, THEN we can start worrying about potential future humans, which have about a fifty percent chance of ever being born.
This comment seems to me to be pretty spot on. I don't walk past a girl getting beaten by her boyfriend, and I absolutley consider myself permitted to intervene on behalf of another life. Seems to me to be a basic tennant for a moral, liberal modern person to live by.
As for this clueless repitition of 'its not a person' 'its not born yet', this dehumanisation of another living being is not only slightly repulsive (and reminicent of all the other attempts to dehumanise victims throughout history, e.g. 'sub-human' blacks and jews - how do you think otherwise moral slaveowners and germans lived with themselves?) but really a bit silly, seeing as i very much doubt you actually believe it.
Here's a check - hands up who would allow termination of babies up to full term? That is, at 8.5 months, the mother could have the baby terminated? No? Then what happened to your nonsense 'birth' argument?
In fact, virtually all societies recognise a childs right to life in the womb, which is why we have a term limit on abortions. This recognises two compeating rights - the womans right to control her body and reproduction, and the babies right to life. I absolutley agree with that compromise of rights, but to say that a fetus has no rights at all, and that good people must remain silent, is, in my view, the very same path that has so often lead the human race into evil.
Interesting that the bible condones the slaughter of children, people of other religions, and slavery. It even places no value upon the lives of infants under a month of age (doesn't even consider them worth noting as human).
All right. This kind of nonsense needs to be stopped and it does nothing to foster legitimate debate.
Everyone alive -- now or at some point in history -- has a finite amount of time on this planet. They will only have firsthand experience of events during that finite time. Events prior to their birth, they will need to be taught and events after their death, they can not know. And during their lifetimes, events they didn't actually witness, must come through second- and third hand sources.
So let's focus on things you know firsthand, cultureshift. Can you tell me what you did/wanted yesterday? A week ago? A year ago? How far back can you go? How have you changed as a person over time?
Now tell me who you were before you were born. Can't do it, can you? Why do you think that is?
Because you weren't a complete person. And I'll be so bold as to say that physically you might be complete but emotionally you're still quite lacking.
@Warren McIntosh:
Here's a check - hands up who would allow termination of babies up to full term? That is, at 8.5 months, the mother could have the baby terminated? No? Then what happened to your nonsense 'birth' argument?
At 8.5 months a fetus can feel pain, and is viable outside the womb. A 4-week-old embryo does not have a nervous system and is not viable outside the womb. There's a huge difference. Besides, if a woman really does not want to go through a pregnancy & birth, why would she wait until she's almost due?
It must feel really good to pat yourself on the back each day for posting worthless drivel on the internet while sitting in your mother's basement. For the rest of us who know real people and engage them in conversation, though, we understand that abortion is not at all like the Holocaust. Not even a little bit.
"People like me are why human atrocities are brought to an end."
That may be the funniest thing I have ever read. How can shifty have such a high opinion of themselves when all they do is yell and annoy.
I didn't see you being the first to don camos, pick up an M-16, and travel to Africa to terminate with extreme prejudice Boko Haram, to free all those girls they'd enslaved, cultureshit.
Subhumans like you are why human atrocities are allowed to exist. You can always do the above to prove me wrong o non -'liberal' chickenhawks.
Can't bring atrocities to an end - as you're claiming - from your basement . Can you?
@creativerealms
"PETZ strikes again."
Or in cultureshit's case: PUTZ . X3
@Warren McIntosh: The fetus is viable in the third trimester, hence abortion at this stage should be avoided unless the woman's health or life is at stake. During the first two trimesters the only "person" in any meaningful, self-aware sense of the word, is the mother. Most Pro-Choice people are as appalled as you at third trimester abortions (except under the circumstance mentioned).
Warren McIntosh: If you think anything cultureshift says is "spot on" then I don't really know what to say. An abortion is not slaughtering human beings nor is it akin to beating someone. Comparing genocide and slavery to the choice to terminate a pregnancy and lumping embryos/zygotes/fetuses with victims of crimes against humanity is actually dehumanizing because you are trivializing the experiences of other people and mocking them for your own agenda.
No, there are actually many people who do not regard embryos etc. to be living beings or people or whatever. Can you really not wrap your head around that?
There are several countries that don't put a cap on abortion and they still don't abort 8.5 month old fetuses. Wonder why that is? Seriously, if a woman is at that stage she can birth it unless it is so deformed or stuck that it would be impossible.
No, a fetus does not actually have any rights. Whether a woman wants to terminate a pregnancy or carry it to term is her business. A fetus cannot actually trump her decision. Abortion is an issue of reproduction choices, family planning, and health. Unless a woman is being forced against her will to either have an abortion or is prevented from getting one it is not a human rights violation.
"Claiming that the slaughter of your fellow human beings isn't your concern only serves to demonstrate your apathy toward others."
You seem to be confuising terminating a pregnancy at an early stage of development with the murder of a human being. Why?
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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