OH I guess I am for the separation of Church and state as long as its understood that atheism and the accompanying evolution is a religion and cannot be taught in schools (nor can ages of fossils and other things tied to origins) after all whats good for the goose is good for the gander.
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EVOLUTION. IS. NOT. A. RELIGION.
EVOLUTION. IS. NOT. ATHEISM.
ATHEISM. IS. NOT. EVOLUTION.
Goddamn. Broken fucking record.
If you're for separation between State and religion, you have to understand the following facts:
Agreed. Science will not be taught in theology class, and theology will not be taught in science class.
The up-and-coming citizens have a natural/Constitutional right to believe whatever they've been brainwashed to believe [or not], and *also* to understand whatever their intellects are capable of.
Evolution is a scientific premise, indeed a very solid theoretical premise.
Creationism is a religious premise, which means it can not be proven or disproven, and all responsibility for "proof" is shunted away on the dead tribe of goatherders that dreamed up the idea in the first place.
Why do you insist on comparing them on the basis of equivalence? Don't sacrifice your meagre supply of brain cells for this exercise; you'll just be smacked down, again and again and again and again....
By the way, what you propose is censorship. That is totalitarian suppression, and it will never be acceptable to "a nation conceived in Liberty".
Trent, are you related to Brent, by any chance?
Thank you for admitting you're really not for separation of church and state.
If you were you wouldn't have put forth such bullshit argument:
1 atheism is not a religion, it is an absence of religious beliefs
2 evolution is science not a religion nor is it in any way connected or dependent upon atheism
3 age of fossils or any other scientifically established ages (eg the age of the universe) are not religions either. Nor are they in any way dependent on either atheism or the theory of evolution.
In my country, the separation of state and religion is called "laïcité" (though you might object that it doesn't work perfectly, as my country has a strong Catholic background).
"laïcité" means, for example, that you shouldn't talk about your religion in school, which includes atheism.
And according to my dictionary, "religion" can mean : "a pursuit of interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance". So Atheism can be, according to that definition, a religion.
So I quite agree that atheism shouldn't be taught in school (well, as far as I know it isn't anyway, at least in the US).
And the theory of evolution of species is definitively a natural science, not a religion.
Let me get this straight, you think that the separation of church and state means that we can't have our kids taught science in school because you can't trust your own kids to learn your religion in your church and home, and my kids have to lose an important part of their education because your kids have parents who too stupid to understand the definitions of atheism and religion. Not just no, hell no.
#272540 I don't care what your dictionary says because dictionary.com says, "a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs."
So by this definition (a much more accepted definition by the way) atheism isn't a religion.
As for Trent neither is the Theory of Evolution.
Well, my dictionary (Merriam-Webster's Collegiate, 11th ed.) says that religion is a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith .
So, yeah, for some people atheism can be a religion. So can a lot of things.
I would gladly stop talking about my atheism if they would stfu about Christianity.
Well good mr Trent claims he is 'slightly to the right of Jerry Falwell'
Sorry, I think you just fell off the earth.
Look, here's an idea.
We teach SCIENCE in SCIENCE CLASS. Since a overwhelming majority of the SCIENTIFFIC COMMUNITY accepts evolution, let's throw it in.
Then we teach CREATION in RELIGION CLASS, and have the xtrianity-atheism discussion there.
Then you aren't really for the seperation of Church and state. You are for the suppression of anything that does not agree with your personal, faith-based convictions. Evolution is not religion, it is not faith-based. It is scientifically based, and should evidence be compiled to contradict it, will be readily and willingly abandoned by the scientific community. No such evidence has ever been presented, nor does it seem likely that it ever will. And please remember that because it is a faith-claim book, the Bible does not constitute scientific proof any more than the Koran or the Baghravad Gita does.
Eric, "a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe (...)" is what atheism is for me.
Of course, the superhuman stuff is bullshit, but it's not a prerequisite of the definition.
So if someone's religion says that the earth rests on the back of a turtle, it should be illegal to teach that the earth orbits the sun in accordance with the law of gravity?
Evolution isn't a religion. That nonsense theory was already tried in court and shot down decades ago.
And there's that whole solid correlation between education and IQ and atheism, so all the smart people and educated people should move to Europe and Canada, and they should stop teaching facts in US schools.
Trent can be the next presi-duh-nt.
Let's put on the broken record one more time!
Science is for science class.
Now sing it with me!
Atheism is not a religion.
Atheism is not a prerequisite for evolutionary theory. There are theists that believe it, too.
Evolution is a scientifically accepted theory (Before you state the immortal "THEEEEORY IZ NOT FACTZEZ!" gravity is a theory too. All theory means is that there's still ongoing research in the field. Not that it's disputed.) and as such should be taught in science classes. You are more than welcome to tell your kids that it's wrong. But you cannot snip pages from textbooks just because your theology disagrees.
Science is taught in schools as a method of observing occurrences and making hypothesis from those occurrences, then proving this hypothesis by duplicating the events and making even more observations. This was how evolution was formed. Science is the exact opposite of faith. Faith requires 100% belief in the text. Science requires 100% proving of the text. You can't compare the two, and you can't put a religion in a scientific setting or a scientific theory in a religious setting. It just doesn't work. Apples and oranges. Athiesm isn't taught in schools to begin with. Because whether there is a god or not is irrelevant to science class. It doesn't matter if that puzzle you're solving was manufactured or just accidentally broken into a million pieces, you're just trying to solve it.
No, evolution is a scientific theory that has evidence backing it up, which means it's not a religion, which is based on myths and blind faith. Evolution is a fact and creationism is religious bullshit. Deal with it.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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