Tim Dukeman #fundie

Tim Dukeman #fundie afellowtruthseeker.blogspot.com

Bible-believing Christian: Homosexuality is wrong because the Bible says so, clearly, in several places.
Culture-believing Christian: You're not supposed to judge!
Bible: What do you think about the holocaust?
Culture: It was Horrible! Obviously....
Bible: Why was it horrible?
Culture: Because a bunch of people were murdered!
Bible: Why does it bother you that people were murdered?
Culture: Because Genocide is wrong! What's wrong with you?
Bible: Aren't you judging Hitler?
Culture: Well....
Bible: What's the difference between me saying that homosexuality is wrong and you saying that Genocide is wrong? Aren't both of us judging?
Culture: You're a homophobe!
Bible: Classy. Is that your judgment of me? Have you judged me to be guilty of homophobia? That's the second time you've judged today!
Culture: Stop judging me! You're not supposed to judge!
Bible: So are you going to retract your earlier statement that Genocide is wrong? Or are you going to admit that sometimes judging can be productive and helpful?
Culture: [storms off]

69 comments

old comment by Hasan Prishtina

Hmm... reminds me of Lord Haw Haw's "dialogs" between Smith and Schmidt about Nazi Germany's moral virtues...

"Bible-believing" Christian, of course, cannot accept that morality can exist beyond what the Bible says and says he accepts the "moral laws" of the Old Testament while a) not defining what he means by "moral law" and b) conveniently forgetting such moral laws as not to embarrass others, not to oppress the weak, not to speak ill of others, not to withhold food, sex, and clothing from your wife, to leave the gleanings of a field for the poor, not to withhold charity for the poor, not to pressure or claim from a borrower, not to withhold wages for a debt, not to work hired hands oppressively, help the poor and destitute and on and on and on.

old comment by rageaholic

How this conversation really went.

Bible-believing Christian: Homosexuality is wrong because the Bible says so, clearly, in several places.
Culture-believing Christian: You're not supposed to judge!
Bible: What do you think about the holocaust?
Culture: It was Horrible! Obviously....
Bible: Why was it horrible?
Culture: Because a bunch of people were murdered!
Bible: Why does it bother you that people were murdered?
Culture: Because Genocide is wrong! What's wrong with you?
Bible: Aren't you judging Hitler?
Culture: Well...
Bible: What's the difference between me saying that homosexuality is wrong and you saying that Genocide is wrong? Aren't both of us judging?
Culture: There's a big difference between advocating the murder of millions and being gay. Murder actually causes harm to people.
Bible: But homosexuality harms people. What about aids!!
Culture: Aids comes from straight couples.
Bible: Well... You're going to hell!
Culture: Classy...

old comment by Passerby

The difference is that genocide, murder, rape, theft, assault, abuse, slavery, and other things generally considered wrong by modern culture have a very direct, readily apparant, often permanent detrimental effect on another sapient being that is seen in physical reality.

For homosexuality the 'harm' you think it causes is of an entirely theoretical nature assuming that it somehow offends a being you believe created everything, including homosexuality, based on a fictional document that claims to be fourth-hand testimony to that entity's wishes.

It is not arbitrary, it is not dogma, it is not a trend, it's sense that I'd call common if not for it's elusive rarity.

old comment by Steven Mading

For those of us who aren't Bible believers, there's a far better and simpler counter to this common weak argument that the bible is an absolute standard while anything human-invented isn't.

The bible is human-invented too. Even if you believe in a god, the bible is still stuff that HUMANS wrote *about* god, not stuff god wrote.

The fact that the morality we are following is human-invented is true of both me AND you. But I'm the only one being honest about it. You, on the other hand, are lying about it. I say "lying" because I don't believe for a moment that you actually think god sat down with paper and a quill and started writing the texts that later became the Bible. You know perfectly well that your morality is just as human-invented as mine is, but you find it politically expedient to feign ignorance of that.

old comment by Clawdragons

How such a conversation would actually go.
"Bible-believing Christian" responses have been left the same since this is obviously a script, and they don't deviate.

Bible-believing Christian: Homosexuality is wrong because the Bible says so, clearly, in several places.

*Sound of a strawman being beaten up and shoved in a closet*

Me (disguised as the aforementioned strawman): Yeah. Good thing society has advanced, eh?

Bible: What do you think about the holocaust?

Me: Why are you asking? You know my answer already. It was horrible. Get on with your tract.

Bible: Why was it horrible?

Me: Because millions of people were murdered.

Bible: Why does it bother you that people were murdered?

Me: The taking of others' lives in such a manner is cruel and horrific. There is no justification for genocide, no matter who committed it. *cough Noah's Flood cough cough*

Bible: Aren't you judging Hitler?

Me: Yes. And your fictional deity as well.

Bible: What's the difference between me saying that homosexuality is wrong and you saying that Genocide is wrong? Aren't both of us judging?

Me: Yes, we are both judging. However, I am judging Hitler based on the harm his actions have done, on the standards of kindness and empathy. I understand suffering, and my morality stems from a desire to mitigate it. You, on the other hand, relish the idea of gays burning forever in agony because you don't like the sort of sex they have.

Bible: Classy. Is that your judgment of me? Have you judged me to be guilty of homophobia? That's the second time you've judged today!

Me: Third, if you include my judgement of your omnicidal deity, in this conversation alone.

Bible: So are you going to retract your earlier statement that Genocide is wrong? Or are you going to admit that sometimes judging can be productive and helpful?

Me: You'd like me to retract my statement about genocide, wouldn't you? Considering the number of times your God supposedly committed it according to that book of yours. Yeah but no. I'm sticking with that one.

Tim Dukeman #fundie afellowtruthseeker.blogspot.com

69 comments

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