Just recently I began, finally, tithing. I had a lot of reasons for not tithing, ranging from thinking that it was an old-testament issue to the plain and simple “I can’t afford it.”
Recently, I became convicted on this lapse, and have surrendered myself to tithing, no matter what the consequences. If we lose the house or a car along the way, then so be it. God is getting His money first.
84 comments
(fundiesRtehlulz)
Game, set, match to fundiesRtehlulz.
/thread
Fundie joke time
"One day a Pastor is telling the congregation how the money given through offerings helps the Pastor with food, clothing, and etc.
Later that day a little boy comes up and hands the Pastor $2.00. The Pastor is thinking "OK". He takes the money and asked the little boy what it is for. The little boy responds well my dad said "Your the POOREST Pastor we have ever had."
God doesn´t need your money...
There is no mention of money being the things that god needs ;)
Very fundie...and yet I approve, this guy isn't hypocritical.
Community Churches, despite the stench of religion about them, are charities. They do do Good Works, despite the tendency to have backwards political and social bents to them.
And Christ did say that the rich man who gives much and lives well has done less good than the poor woman who gives her last penny.
So...props to him
If your god was so real and so all powerful, why would he need your money? This guy is supposedly able to read everyone's minds, see everyone's futures, judge who goes to hell or heaven, is the supposed creator of everything and anything, and yet...he needs your money?
Makes no flipping fucking sense, fundies.
First off, shame on you for not being a good chirstian. by not tithing. Second, shame on you for not being someone who stays within their . If you can't afford to live within your means, then you need to find a way to either make more money or budget what you have.
<George Carlin>
He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He's all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can't handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bullshit story. Holy Shit!
</George Carlin>
I hope at least that in "giving to God", you're giving directly to organizations that help the poor in some way, rather than to some filthy rich mega-church, which will only use the money to get richer still (like the Mormons, who are building a billion-plus dollar shopping mall in Salt Lake City with the ten percent tithe they extort, under threat, from their followers). Sadly, though, I doubt it.
If this money is being given to charity (i.e. the people that actually need it) rather than to his local priests choir boy fund, then this quote ain't so bad, in fact it's downright honourable.
But why do I get the nagging feeling that when this money is going to "God", it's going to one of his representatives, not to the people that need it most?
"God is getting His money first."
Excuse me, I'd just like to ask a question. What does God need with a starship money?
What does God need with a starship money? </Kirk>
Seriously, why the hell would the supposedly all-powerful creator of the friggin universe need money?
Guys - seriously... Believers don't give money to God because God needs it - you do have something right when you say he doesn't need our things because he created everything!
But God loves a generous heart, its not the money that he desires but our love and service - our faith that he will sustain us through the hard times. This person is showing faith that God will hold true to his promises - such as those in Matthew 6:25-27
"[25]Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? [26] Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they? [27] Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life?"
Hi Blackvoice - yeah, it's a pretty bleak existance if you consider just yourself another creature on par with all the other creatures - and yet have the capacity to fathom things like love, mercy, compassion and eternity... Maybe it might just suggest there is a God?
@kiwiandrew17:
Except tithing is not "generosity", or you could equally give your money to the poor, charities, strangers, etc.
Tithing is specifically giving money to God's priests not because of generosity but because God orders it (Numbers 18). Money you might otherwise have given as alms or charitable donations has been taken out of the equation to keep the priests in wine and funny hats.
This, then, is how "the Lord will provide" is it?
"[you] have the capacity to fathom things like love, mercy, compassion and eternity... Maybe it might just suggest there is a God?"
No. It suggests I have a brain.
yeah, it's a pretty bleak existance if you consider just yourself another creature on par with all the other creatures - and yet have the capacity to fathom things like love, mercy, compassion and eternity... Maybe it might just suggest there is a God?
I am not "more," just different. And I have no idea what birds fathom, so I can't say.
Good point David, but I think whether you're giving money out of obedience or generosity, to the work of the church, it's this act of service that pleases God, not the money itself.
It pleases God when we are willing to sacrifice things for his sake. Although these things do not save us - only Jesus saves us.
If you are not more than a bird, why do birds not rule the world the way man does, as leader over all the other species?
So, fuck the kids and their inconvenient need to eat, right?
As long as the church gets theirs, that's the important thing.
Prioritize much?
God is getting His money first.
Yes, because the omnipotent creator of the universe just can't seem to scrape two pennies together...
"If you are not more than a bird, why do birds not rule the world the way man does, as leader over all the other species?"
"Bird" is not a species, but at one point at the beginning of the Teriary period, bird species occupied almost all the "top predator positions", as their ancestors the dinosaurs had before them.
Your question doesn't make sense because it is an example of a fallacy called "affirming the consequent". Basically, the argument is stated as "If P is true, Q must be true. Q is true, therefore P is true."
If I had bird flu then I would feel ill.
Mind you, I don't see by what right we could claim to be leader over all other species. If anything rules the world, it's the single-celled organism, all multicellular life added together has neither its numbers, mass, variety, resilience, longevity, etc. And a significant proportion of multicellular organisms would die without it.
Birds not being a species - now that's being nit-picky!
By ruling, i mean that humans alter their environment and adjust their eco-systems to suit their needs in a way no creature has ever done before. Anyway there's pages of argument that could go on on this topic - feel free to email me at kiwiandrew@gmail.com
And my argument wasn't if P is true Q must be true etc...
It was if P does not equal Q and R does equal Q, then P must be fundementally different to R - logical isn't it?
Anyway you can't prove God using logic and reasoning - you can only provide a lot of arguments using logic and reasoning. To prove God you have to experience him for yourself, and that I cannot do.
But I will pray for you.
Peace,
Birds not being a species - now that's being nit-picky!
By ruling, i mean that humans alter their environment and adjust their eco-systems to suit their needs in a way no creature has ever done before. Anyway there's pages of argument that could go on on this topic - feel free to email me at kiwiandrew@gmail.com
And my argument wasn't if P is true Q must be true etc...
It was if P does not equal Q and R does equal Q, then P must be fundementally different to R - logical isn't it?
Anyway you can't prove God using logic and reasoning - you can only provide a lot of arguments using logic and reasoning. To prove God you have to experience him for yourself, and that I cannot do.
But I will pray for you.
Peace,
"Anyway you can't prove God using logic and reasoning"
Yes, but that is because the idea of an omnipotent god is logically incoherent.
"But I will pray for you."
If it makes you feel better, feel free.
Why does a all-powerful, all-knowing being need money? For someone who was able to create the universe in 6 days, he sure can't handle money very well, can he?
To be honest, the only reason people tithe first is because the priests promise them that whatever they give, god will return 10-fold. I haven't actually seen it, but there's always a friend of a friend who went from welfare to riches because god blessed them for tithing.
"And my argument wasn't if P is true Q must be true etc... It was if P does not equal Q and R does equal Q, then P must be fundementally different to R - logical isn't it?"
"Different to" does not mean "more than", as was pointed out earlier.
"To prove God you have to experience him for yourself, and that I cannot do."
I will be charitable and assume you did not mean that you cannot experience God for yourself. :)
I agree, implicit in the concept of an all-powerful being is that you can not prove or even perceive their existence if they do not wish it, since there is no test nor experiment that they could not control to the absolute degree. But this begs the question, why is God hiding? It's not like he even owes taxes on all the money he's collected, is it?
kiwiandrew17,
If your god existed and was a deity worthy of worship, he would never want one of his followers to worry about losing his home or car as a consequence of tithing. But this is the same god who asked Abraham to sacrifice Isaac as a trick, so we know that he's nothing more than a psychopathic bully.
It's your money -- do as you please. Although, I hope you don't have any dependents: I had to experience a frighteningly similar situation with my father as a kid, and it was bizarre, to say the least.
Oh, well, what do you expect from RR...
There are some dumb comments here. The purpose of tithing is so that churches have money in order to operate. Granted, some churches are rather corrupt (ie many megachurches) and end up putting all the money in the pockets of greedy pastors, but there are plenty of churches that use the money not just for the operation of the church but also for service opportunities. And if you're a Christian, you probably think that the church is an important organization so you'll want to give money to it.
I suppose someone might try to give a counterargument to this that "God should just provide for the church without relying on people's money" but we already know the world doesn't work that way, whether God actually exists or not. It's very similar to the question of why God doesn't just go around healing sick people. Maybe doctors are the medium through which he chooses to act, and maybe people giving tithes are the way in which God expects the church to keep running. It's all speculation of course, but I would expect people who claim to be logical to at least think about things.
However, the thing that bothers me is that there are a lot of Christians that think that tithing is all one needs to do; giving to charities is unnecessary since you're already tithing to the church. That's pretty lousy and isn't very Jesus-like I don't think.
Just so everyone knows though, I'm not defending RebMel here. Family should always come first, and people that believe otherwise are crazy (and unfortunately all too common).
"Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they?"
What utter bull shit. Some birds DO starve to death, and your imaginary sky fairy does nothing to stop it. (Not to mention all the other starving animals and children that god ignores.)
Be generous with your money to the point you can afford it and support legitimate charities that actually help people in need because it's the right thing to do not because it gives you the warm fuzzies to imagine a god is going to pat your head for being such a good boy.
The amount I rend "unto Caesar", if God wants any he's asking the wrong damn person anyway.
Mind you...
*A phone rings* * There is a flash of light, and a host of angels appear in the IRS office, drawing back a curtain they reveal a "god's eye" view of Tony Mulville on his knees in his bedroom, he has his hands clasped in prayer and can be distinctly heard to say "Please God, do something about my taxes!" * declared your income from these 'tithes' at all?"church has a religious exemption, not members thereof."from a church, either as salary or in return for services is liable for tax."* Click, brrrrrrr... *
"I suppose someone might try to give a counterargument to this that "God should just provide for the church without relying on people's money" but we already know the world doesn't work that way, whether God actually exists or not."
But the god they profess to believe in says it does.
John 15:7, "If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you."
Like a lightning conductor on a steeple, expecting the congregation to foot the bills shows a distinct lack of faith on the part of a church, IMO.
In the words of the late, great George Carlin:
"God loves you! And he needs MONEY! He is the omnipotent all powerful being but he can't quite get a handle on this 'money thing'."
I think your god would understand priorities.
I dont mind that they give so much of a percentage each pay check (some stuff goes to charities and to help the poor), it can be in theory a good idea. However I know christians who sensibly draw the line at losing their essential amenities because of it.
Priests who require tithing? Shameless charlatans to a man.
The mega-churches would die tomorrow if tithing was ever abolished as every bogus scamming pastor (and that's every one)would be off like a shot.
House? Car?
You can't prove God, ghosts or Souls by logic and reasoning and evidence.
What's the difference between a the guy who sends you a spam Nigerian 419 email and your Pastor?
Nothing, they're both trying to get you to part with cash up-front on the promise of a non-existent product.
Yeah we all know god needs his money! In my city, inner city Catholic elementary schools are being closed down due to lack of funding yet the church just spent millions to build a new cathedral when the diocese has two perfectly good cathredrals already.
A real man supports his family FIRST! My personal opinion is that churches should be taxed out of existance.
Damnit, and people still think Marx was wrong about this stuff?
Religion is a tool for keeping the poor poor! Raarrrghh.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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