Oh no, here comes someone throwing out that magical, fantasy "gay gene" that does not exist.
Homosexuality is not biological, this is about a choice--and only a choice. It is nurture versus nature.
Next thing you people will want is a gene that causes drug additions, or a gene that causes gambling addictions, or a gene that causes kleptomania--because let's remember that most kleptomaniancs say they cannot fight the "urge" to steal.
See how ridiculous you sound trying to justify homosexuality as genetic??
There is no biological or scientific evidence for homosexuality. It is strictly a choice to act and live that lifestyle.
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The sad thing is that if they would admit it was controlled by a gene, and then also would admit that designer babies is okay. They could make sure never to have gay children ever again!
But nooooooo, they somehow want it to be a mistake they made raising them, or demons or something.
Yes, you are right. The earth is also flat and women should be kept for cooking, cleaning, fucking and farting out babies. *sarcasm (for those that are too thick)*
At no stage in my life did I choose to be heterosexual. It has always been; hot horney chick (awooga, awooga, awooga, pant, pant, pant, movement in the groin region etc), bloke (eh, now where's that woman again). So, when did you choose your sexual orientation SteF95?
Kleptomania is a legitimate affliction, if treated properly, the people who had it will go on to lead happier and more productive lives, penis wrinkle.
Next thing you people will want is a gene that causes breathing. Then someone will get the idea that God didn't give Adam the breath of life, and then homosexuals will go and have homosexual sex because of it, which will lead to the world burning in fire and brimstone after the antichrist (Barack Obama) declares breathing illegal because God gave man breath.
See how ridiculous you sound trying to justify homosexuality having no genetic influence because you don't want to believe it?
Actually there is no evidence at all that there is a genetic component to homosexuality. I will say the same thing that is so so often posted here:
citation needed.
If someone can cite a real peer reviewed article (please don't mention the much refuted cadaver brain study or anything with events in utero since that is not genetic) that there is such a genetic component, please give the reference here.
A much more likely scenario, incidentally is not the ridiculous idea that it is a choice, but the Freudian that everyone is capable of hetero- and homosexual desire from a biological view point, but that the manifestation of sexuality is shaped by childhood experiences, socialization etc. The inability to feel heterosexual desire is then a psychoneurosis, hardly anything worth worrying about from the viewpoint of society.
See how ridiculous you sound trying to justify homosexuality as genetic??
No, SteF95 sounds ridiculous for inventing a hypothetical "slippery slope" premise and then using it as if it were true.
There is no evidence of a drug addition, gambling addiction or kleptomania gene. There is good evidence that male homosexuality is either genetic or has an in utero basis, evidence that sexual orientation is determined at a very young age, if not at infancy, and no evidence that it is a choice made after the "age of accountability" (to use the language of the predominantly Baptist bigots who come up with this crap) other than the wishful thinking of bigots who want to pretend their dislike of gays is rational.
@Helena: "please don't mention the much refuted cadaver brain study or anything with events in utero since that is not genetic"
"In utero" can be a genetic issue with the mother.
@Helena
The inability to feel heterosexual desire is then a psychoneurosis, hardly anything worth worrying about from the viewpoint of society.
Did you just say that homosexuality is a mild mental disorder ? Did you seriously just say that? I hate to break it to you, but that line of thinking comes from the same kind of people who would force their sons into sports or more 'butch' things to 'keep the gay' away, or vice-versa for their daughters in order to change their childhood experience so as to prevent them from being gay.
It doesn't work.
It is not a fucking mental disorder, however mild, to be treated like we would say autism. It's fine for you to say that it's hardly 'worth worrying about', but you've classified it as a disease, as though we need to change our behaviour in rearing children to keep the gay away!
Yes. A "gay gene" has not been found yet. But, that DOES NOT MEAN IT ISN'T BIOLOGICAL! Morons...
Also, homosexuality doesn't harm anyone, and drug and gambling problems are personal problems too, so I don't see the issue here!
Edit: Helena...there is no genetic proof. We don't know where the gene is located, if it exists, or how it works. Breathe easy that you can continue to hate people because we only have a wide series of correlations that suggest a biological cause, rather than exact knowledge of the gene responsible. But if you were referring to LeVay's study as discreditted...you're wrong. Just because it was "refuted" by a few people who wanted to critique the infamous study does not mean that it has been discarded by the scientific community, which still holds it in relatively high esteem.
I don't believe there is one Gene that will stand out and say hello, I'm Gay. It's probably a combination of how some genes work together.
One example is a nephew of mine that is so much like his uncle its scary. Yet they've probably only met about 5 times in their lives and had very different upbringings. They even have the same mannerisms, sense of humour, and taste in things.
The only ones who have a "choice" in the matter, really, are the bisexuals. Other than that, well... just... no.
*yawn* become gay for a week, yadda yadda yadda.
Also there are people who are more predisposed to addiction.
Not that anyone else will be reading this by now, but...
1. I did not say that homsoexuality was a mental disorder like autism. It is a psychoneurosis like having no interest in women with small breasts. Its not that big a deal.
2. Where on earth does anyone gain the impression that I hate homosexuals, please adduce the evidence. Do I have to send you testimonials from all the women I've slept with?
1. There are people who are more addicted to things. I quite smoking cold turkey. Hell I quit my vicodin medication STRAIGHT cold turkey. I don't think I have an addictive personality. I know others who get addicted to even chocolate.
2. Homosexuality is biological with evolutionary advantages.
3. Gambling is part of human culture. It's calculated risks. I am addicted to thrill seeking and controlled danger. I like roller coasters, fast cars, bungee jumping, hitch hiking, It's risk taking. Risk taking may lose a lot but it can win big. And that is quite a succesful strategy. People like me are willing to hold their ground against much larger opponents and this in itself provides a quality of it's own. Sometimes you gamble with something as "worthless" as money. Sometimes you gamble with feelings such as your pride when you ask a lady out or your life when you get on a rollercoaster (the point of them is you are fooling yourself into thinking it is dangerous when it is perfectly safe). It's often a very big advantage. Primarily since it allowed humans to try stuff that they would never do.
3. Kleptomania was encouraged in some societies (but punished if you were caught) it toughens the individuals up. It's mainly "thrill seeking" of a sort.
4. Lots of animals are homosexual. Biological. Scientific wise... If I showed real heterosexual behaviour I would proceed to kill or drive away every male I met. I would then rape every woman. Because that is what true heterosexual behaviour is. We don't show it because we have developed the ability "like bonobos" to have sex as a way of cementing bonds.
(Captain Obvious)
"The sad thing is that, if they would admit it was controlled by a gene, and then also would admit that designer babies is okay. They could make sure never to have gay children ever again!"
They daren't ever do that, for one simple reason:
For them to admit that homosexuality is genetic, they would also be forced to admit (whether implicitly or explicitly) that homosexual people aren't converted or recruited, but created naturally. This destroys their tired old argument that their god hates homosexuality, and they aren't about to let that happen at any time soon (not within my natural lifespan, as much as I'd love to live to see such a day).
Drug addicitions, gambling addictions and kleptomania are demonstrably destructive and burdensome to society. Your lot has not yet demonstrated how homosexuality is destructive, outside of the predictable and unjust impact of mental and emotional turmoil inflicted by ignorant loudmouths who equate homosexuality with mental, moral or spiritual weakness. Furthermore, your lot has yet to demonstrate how homosexuality is burdensome to society. And, no, the fact that it makes you say "ew" and that you get embarrassed when your children ask about it do not constitute a burden on society.
In short SteF95, quit trying to change the subject (as your lot always seems to try and do) and give a substantial argument for your side. If you cannot, accept that you are on the losing side of this debate. In other words, put up or shut up.
Homosexuality is biological and congenital.
Why would anyone choose something that makes you hated, vilified, and perhaps even killed?
Did you choose Christianity? Did you choose stupidity?
There are people who are more prone to addictions than others, yes, but as those things harm the person and his/her environment, they are bad. Homosexuality harms no-one, and is therefore OK.
There is lots and lots of evidence for homosexuality.
Biology is a part of Science, stupid.
Homosexuality is not biological, this is about a choice--and only a choice. It is nurture versus nature.
But if it is nurture“, how can it be a choice.
That said, it does not matter if it is a choice or not. It does not unduly infringe on the rights of others, so there is not rational reason to condemn it.
I, for example, don’t like to eat fish or seafood. I find the thought alone disgusting. But as long as no one tries to force me to eat that stuff, I have no problem when others do it.
@Helena
Something doesn't need to be genetic to be biologically innate, and the brain study has not been refuted. Of course, I shouldn't expect much scientific knowledge from someone who goes on about discredited theories while attempting to use Freudian psychology to classify homosexuality as a mental disease.
Oh no, here comes another moronic fundie who believes that being gay is a choice and would rather swim in a vat of nuclear waste than consider that her or she is completely wrong.
Tell me, who would actually choose to be gay when there are people like you cluttering up this world?
Moot point (even if you were correct).
We're free to make choices. If you don't like people exerting their freedom of choice, then maybe you should get the fuck out of America.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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