[In a thread about a 14 year old girl stoned to death by her father (on suspision for having an afair)]
Murdering is bad, but there is nothing in totally disowning and disinheriting a slut by the family. If the muslims just stuck with totally cutting off relations with those whores, I would support them totally. Unfortunately, too many innocent women are being hurt and killed.
52 comments
So if a woman makes a bad decision, or gets drunk, or is raped, or does nothing at all but is SUSPECTED of doing something, she's a 'slut' and a 'whore', and deserves to be disowned and disinherited? And this doesn't count as being 'hurt'?
And why they have to cut off ties with women who have affaires?, because Jesus did the same with the poor Mary Magdalaine?, because love is now conditional, according to Christianity?
On the plus side, he is at least saying that "murdering is bad" and refers to the fact that some of the girls hurt are innocent. He's still a little overboard against sexually active teens (disowning them would hardly fix the situation, but would in fact almost guarantee that they become "whores," even if they weren't to start with), but at least he seems to not support killing them.
Wow...you hear of this catastrophic result of adhering literally to ancient precepts and acting upon feelings of righteousness rather than rationality, and all you have to say is "murder bad" and go on to blame the victim? I would give you a sarcastic round of applause, but then I would only be encouraging you.
fundie men (and come to think of it, women too) still don't seem to get that women are just people. you have no power over them. no god-given power. no male-is-superior power. nothing. give it up. the longer you fundies hold on to this idea that you're better than women, the angrier you're going to get as your manipulation and brute force tactics start to fail.
Ahhh... Fundie family values in action. I hope your daughter puts you in a decrepit nursing home that's not up to state code when you get old and helpless. You know the old saying" You earn respect by giving respect". You do not automatically get it when you become a parent.
Edit
Prostitution is often an act of desperation for a runaway, they are not trying to shame or embarrass the family by being "whores" as you put it. They are trying to survive.
I can see by some of the attitudes fundies have that it is no surprise that their daughters run away.
In John 8:11b, Jesus talks to an adulterous woman: "Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more." How you go from Jesus' clearly lenient attitude to saying a girl suspected of having had an affair must be shunned and disinherited by her family is beyond me.
If you call yourself a Christian, shouldn't you heed his words as the Son of God before those of any other, or do you imply he was less informed than, say, Paul?
What's the point of a one-man stoning?
Stoning takes advantage of crowd psychology, so that a barbaric society can execute it's chosen hate target whilst minimising guilt and remorse and hence any chance of rejection of its principles by the executors. Any one member of the baying mob hurling rocks can excuse themselves by the fact that their contribution to the overall suffering and death of the vicitm was very small.
Even as recently as the world wars, firing squads would be given randomly allocated blank and live cartridges so that any one member of the execution party could delude themselves that, statistically, they weren't likely to have been "responsible" for the death of a fellow soldier by obeying their orders; they might have been the one to fire the blank.
To anyone sufficiently intelligent enough to have a basic grasp of social dynamics, the fallacy and the danger of such thinking is as obvious as is its effectiveness at manipulating those who aren't.
Evidently the fundie in question is nowhere near intelligent enough to grasp even vaguely the point of stoning, and simply did it dogmatically because it's the traditional, prescribed method. When only one person carries out an "execution" by stoning, it's just vastly inefficient (and hence all the more needlessly brutal as the victim dies slowly and in agony from multiple blows) and doesn't even have its original advantage of "diluting responsibility". Mobs of self-righteous hotheads are collectively dangerous, vicious and stupid. This person is even more vicious, even more stupid and hence even more dangerous.
Would the disowning and disinheriting happen to a boy who was suspected of having an affair?
Oh no, I forgot. Men can do no wrong and women aren't people.
It doesn't make a shred of difference if this turd has managed to reach the lofty moral heights of realising that "murdering is bad". No decent human being relates to the sick brutality commited by the muslim father. Even agreeing with him in principle is twisted beyond description.
We're talking about a man who bludgeoned his daughter to death with rocks for transgressing a religious law. There's only one sane reaction to somebody like that; you label them a murderous psychopath and stop recognising them as member of a civillised society. It's on a par with saying "Pol Pot, yes he killed a lot of people, but you can't deny that he knew how to motivate people."
"Pol Pot, yes he killed a lot of people, but you can't deny that he knew how to motivate people."
Even though it's true. Hell, Hitler was a vegetarian and tried to prevent people from smoking!
That would be like claiming someone can be totaly evil. From the moraly relativist standpoint I use, it is non-sensical.
However that murderer is an asshole and deserves some 9 mm medication for a bad case of total douchebagery.
"ProudSecularist
#466342
I read somewhere that women can get married at a very young age in Iran (13 or 14) so she could actually be married!"
"A man can marry a girl younger than nine years of age, even if the girl is still a baby being breastfed. A man, however is prohibited from having intercourse with a girl younger than nine, other sexual act such as forplay, rubbing, kissing and sodomy is allowed. A man having intercourse with a girl younger than nine years of age has not comitted a crime, but only an infraction, if the girl is not permanently damaged. If the girl, however, is permanently damaged, the man must provide for her all her life. But this girl will not count as one of the man's four permanent wives. He also is not permitted to marry the girl's sister."http://www.homa.org/Details.asp?ContentID=2137352748&TOCID=2083225413
Of course the Koran has no such age limit, according to Q 65:4 and Q33:49 a "woman" can be married off (and have sex with) as soon as she pops out of her moms vagina:http://www.wikiislam.com/wiki/Pedophilia_in_the_Qur%27an
Harsh.
Christians are supposed to live up to the ideal of Jebus. I can't imagine a personification of good that would disown a "slut".
This is what happens when you get your morality from a book instead of from empathy for other humans.
@Ixolite
You just killed any chance I had of feeling good today. Fucking killed it, grabbed it by the hair and slit its throat, sawed until the head was almost off, then threw it into a pit.
FUCKING KILLED IT.
ixolite :
Khomeni did NOT say that.
That was a hoax, attrubuted to him in an attempt to make him look bad. (Well, to look more bad than he already did, at any rate.)
so evil
so judgemental
so hypocritical
Well since we all know women don't have souls, why does it matter? I mean they were just created to be help meets for the men, no better than a draft horse or herding dog.
http://www.landoverbaptist.org/news0500/femsoul.html
[/sarcasm]
Sorry, I'm just getting sick of it.
So she is suspected and already is a slut or whore. And why should they be cut off unless they are doing some actual crimes and hurting people? They aren't. They are merely suspect (and adultery? If she is making with a married man, I would fault him more than her since he would be married. But since men are not to be punished... Otherwise it, and my guess is, she may be having sex consentually. Doesn't mean adultery nor is a crime or sin. But your hate of women is almost as bad as if not just as bad as the father)
Feel the Christian lurve. Also, I hope you never ever have children. Please, do the world a favor, and never reproduce.
@ tracer:
It might be a hoax, I can't verify that. The site I linked to has a farsi scan out of his book, but since I don't speak it, I can't tell where she took it from.
BUT: Fact is, Khomeini lowered the age of marriage for "women" to 9 when he came to power. Fact is also that, as "women" are considered adults with 9, the can also be sentenced to death at that age. (You can find his little green book online on prophetofdoom, btw.) But that is going a bit OT.
@ all:
I forwarded some of the comments here to arbitor85 and here is his answer:
"1. I am not the model christian. Should be very obvious to you too, but not to those people on the forum, who hardly know me. http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1077387#1077387
@ixolite
2. Jesus and Mary Magdalene? God, it is a good thing I was not a member of such a forum, where people seem to lack so much basic info. I wise to choose this intelligent one. . I have a feeling that the most these folks know about christianity might be from The Da Vinci code, don't you think?
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone? Go, and sin no more? Now that said, I'm not boned up on the Bible, so I'm not sure if the adulteress was MM, or another person. Either way, Jesus ASSOCIATED with a prostitute, and decried those that would condemn a "whore."
Just as Jesus would do, not mingle with sinners...........wow,I think I was talking about Jesus Valcarcel, my neighbour. Sorry for the typo.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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