David J. Stewart #fundie

David J. Stewart #fundie jesus-is-savior.com

Ask an atheist if he or she believes in the existence of aliens? If they answer, "no," then ask them how do they know that? Have they gone to all the other galaxies throughout the universe? The truth is that no atheist can reasonably deny the existence of alien life. To do so would be utter ignorance. If an atheist answers, "yes," then they have contradicted their claim that there is no God. Is not God an Alien? By every definition of the word, God is an alien, i.e., He is not of this earth. For an atheist to profess believe is alien life, while simultaneously denying the existence of God, is utter hypocrisy and foolishness.

162 comments

old comment by Zeus Almighty

"By every definition of the word, God is an alien, i.e., He is not of this earth."

Massive definition fail. There are other meanings of alien other than little green men.

a?li?en, adj.

1. Owing political allegiance to another country or government; foreign: alien residents.
2. Belonging to, characteristic of, or constituting another and very different place, society, or person; strange. See Synonyms at foreign.
3. Dissimilar, inconsistent, or opposed, as in nature: emotions alien to her temperament.
n.
1. An unnaturalized foreign resident of a country. Also called noncitizen.
2. A person from another and very different family, people, or place.
3. A person who is not included in a group; an outsider.
4. A creature from outer space: a story about an invasion of aliens.
5. Ecology An organism, especially a plant or animal, that occurs in or is naturalized in a region to which it is not native.

old comment by Mudak

I'm not sure if this can be more accurately classified as a strawman argument, or if it's a setup for an ad hominem attack.

The fact of the matter remains, given current knowledge, we are all agnostic with regard to the existence of alien life. Considering that we have started locating planets near enough to the stars that they orbit, that it is possible that they could support life, even if the current crop about which we're aware could not. In spite of the immense difficulty in doing so, it is possible to prove definitively one way or another whether or not alien life exists. Find alien life and you have proven that it exists. Examine literally every planet in the cosmos and you have proven that it does not.

So now, how can you prove the existence of God?

old comment by Cy

Oooh, oooh, let me!

Ask an adoctorist if he or she believes in the existence of aliens? If they answer, "no," then ask them how do they know that? Have they gone to all the other galaxies throughout the universe? The truth is that no adoctorist can reasonably deny the existence of alien life. To do so would be utter ignorance. If an adoctorist answers, "yes," then they have contradicted their claim that there is no Doctor. Is not the Doctor an Alien? By every definition of the word, the Doctor is an alien, i.e., He is not of this earth. For an adoctorist to profess believe is alien life, the Doctor, is utter hypocrisy and foolishness.

(for non Doctor Who themed variations, please replace "the Doctor" with the fictional alien of your choice.)

old comment by Horsefeathers

"If an atheist answers, "yes," then they have contradicted their claim that there is no God. Is not God an Alien? By every definition of the word, God is an alien, i.e., He is not of this earth. For an atheist to profess believe is alien life, while simultaneously denying the existence of God, is utter hypocrisy and foolishness."

Then they must also believe Predators, Xenomorphs from the Aliens series, E.T., every Star Trek and Star Wars species and so on also exist by this reasoning. They all fit the definition of "alien" also, so to accept that alien life may exist in the universe while denying those specific examples exist would, according to you, be hypocrisy and foolishness.

See where your reasoning breaks down?

No, thought not.

old comment by

"Ask an atheist if he or she believes in the existence of aliens? If they answer, "no," then ask them how do they know that?"

Very few atheists would say that, the universe is in tecnical terms, fucking huge. the probability of life evolving on an individual planet is small, but what with 100 million galaxies, with a 1000 million stars each? yeah the huge numbers help. An atheist may say that we simply doo not know...

"Have they gone to all the other galaxies throughout the universe? The truth is that no atheist can reasonably deny the existence of alien life. To do so would be utter ignorance."
yeah okay, with you there... although not believing in aliens isn't ignorant.

"If an atheist answers, "yes," then they have contradicted their claim that there is no God. Is not God an Alien?"
*SMACK* *SMACK* *SMACK* *SMACK* *SMACK*

"By every definition of the word, God is an alien, i.e., He is not of this earth."
Definition of God: An intelligent being that exists outside of this universe, yet who created the universe and all energy and matter within.
Definition of alien: A living organism which has deveoped on another planet independent from earth.

"For an atheist to profess believe is alien life, while simultaneously denying the existence of God, is utter hypocrisy and foolishness."
Oh, I see the foolishness, but not where you think it is.

Have to admit though, it is an original argument. at least it's not Payley's watch or pascal's wager, that we've heard 1000 times before.

old comment by objettrouve24

Men claim that god is right here among us, and does things to affect our world all the time. Very few claim that aliens ever do things to affect our world.

I think when most atheists say they do not believe in god, they are referring to a god of a particular nature, that is, the most common god nature, the kind that is living invisibly among us, working good for those who love him, and does not protect those who don't. So really this argument strategy is forgetting that while technically you could classify god as an alien, the nature of what we consider to be aliens and the nature of what we consider to be god got all mixed up there. The nature we tend to agree on about aliens looks more like pantheistic gods, who do not interfere with us, and might not even be aware of us. The monotheistic gods more closely resemble Santa Claus, who is sometimes as close as our living rooms, does good things for good kids and bad things for bad kids.

On top of that, you are allowing no gray areas. Do I believe in aliens? No, I have no reason to. BUT I acknowledge that it's possible. There are many levels of faith.

old comment by Anon-e-moose

Ask a fundie if they believe in the existence of a 'God'. If they answer 'yes', then ask them to prove the existence of their 'God' to the satisfaction of we Atheists, by making him appear in front of us, in hard, solid, physical form (and no, not 'Jesus', God himself) that can be seen, heard & touched.

Then he proves he is who he says he is, by demonstrations of his power - again, to the satisfaction of we Atheists (and in my case, if that means he must have to do whatever I say - in perpetuity if necessary, so be it). Then - and only then - will we acknowledge the existence of such a being. Whether or not he is actually deserving of 'worship', 'praise' or 'respect' is another matter entirely.

For a Fundamentalist Christian to profess belief in a supernatural, omnipotent deity, whilst simultaneously unable to prove the existence of said deity - to our satisfaction - is utter hypocrisy and foolishness.

Your call Dave, you kiddy-diddling nonce.

old comment by Anon-e-moose

@Dharmabum

"David J. Stewart ... Andy Schlafly ... which is more fucktarded?"

The Canadian fundy spam monster himself; He Who Must Not Be Named, Churchjerk, a.k.a. T**y B****s.

I think that answers your question.

@John_in_Oz

"I checked every dictionary there is, and you're right.

"God = Alien" does appear in a dictionary. Ever heard of "The Fundie Word Redefinition Project"?"

That, or ol' Davey-boy (when not checking out the Disney Channel) is reading too many Erich von Daniken books.

@GigaGuess

"Except here's the thing. God is categorically unprovable."

However, fundies categorically state that their 'God' exists, therefore the onus is on them to prove his existence to the satisfaction of we Atheists (see my previous post). If they can't, ergo he doesn't exist. QED.

Simple logic, really. And logic that destroys fundy 'belief', 'faith' and superstition.

@Felis>:3

"This bloke's obviously quite intelligent and has critical thinking skills (he just isn't using them!), so he can have a rational debate. But if a guy wants to debate someone, he NEEDS TO ACTUALLY READ THEIR POINT OF VIEW AND KNOW WHAT IT IS."

God: 'JESUS CHRIST IT'S A LION GET IN THE DEUS EX MACHINA!'

X3 :3 =^_^=

old comment by

Feynman -

"I have argued flying saucers with lots of people. I was interested in possible. They do not appreciate that the problem is not to demonstrate whether it's possible or not but whether it's going on or not."

"Some years ago I had a conversation with a layman about flying saucers because I am scientific I know all about flying saucers! I said 'I don't think there are flying saucers'. So my antagonist said, 'Is it impossible that there are flying saucers? Can you prove that it's impossible?' 'No', I said, 'I can't prove it's impossible. It's just very unlikely'. At that he said, 'You are very unscientific. If you can't prove it impossible then how can you say that it's unlikely?' But that is the way that is scientific. It is scientific only to say what is more likely and what less likely, and not to be proving all the time the possible and impossible. To define what I mean, I might have said to him, 'Listen, I mean that from my knowledge of the world that I see around me, I think that it is much more likely that the reports of flying saucers are the results of the known irrational characteristics of terrestrial intelligence than of the unknown rational efforts of extra-terrestrial intelligence.' It is just more likely. That is all. "

Something that always amuses me is when non-scientists tell scientists that they're being unscientific. Now, they could very well be correct, but that doesn't in anyway prevent them from sounding like colossal douchebags.

old comment by

Ask an atheist if he or she believes in the existence of dogs? If an atheist answers, "yes," then they have contradicted their claim that there is no Scooby Doo. Is not Scooby Doo a dog? By every definition of the word, Scooby Doo is a dog. For an atheist to profess believe in dog life, while simultaneously denying the existence of Scooby Doo, is utter hypocrisy and foolishness.

> The truth is that no atheist can reasonably deny the existence of alien life.

Not believing in something isn't the same as denying its existence. I personally think the idea of biological life on other planets is highly plausible, but I won't believe it's absolutely true unless/until we actually discover it. It would be silly to say, "life absolutely exists on other planets" without proof, and it would be silly to ever say "life absolutely does not exist on other planets," because we can't prove a negative.

old comment by TWoozl

There's probably some form of extra-solar life out there; the chances of us actually encountering little green men in saucers however? There's actual science that hints at the probability of it; Stack the slice of time that represents our technological existence against the age of the universe, and you have something about the height of a dime, sitting next to the Chrysler building. Metaphorically speaking, the dime belonging to those little green spacemen may have begun at nearly any point after the formation of suns and planets. There's a potentially staggering number of those dimes; We will probably overlook millions, when we're finally spacefaring, or find the remnants of those that preceded us. But the probability is there, that we could hit another "dime", edge to edge.

At least in this case, we have a demonstrable example of the variables involved; Earth itself. We have no such demonstration of gods or creation events occurring in six days, and in fact, the evidence points away from the Biblical hypothesis quite sharply. No explanation of extra-solar planets or why they even exist in a creation story focused on just one little blue marble. No explanation of when God decided to create other suns, or why they are called 'stars' and ours just happens to be a sun, not another star. Any number of contradictions. Logical fallacies. Physical impossibilities (See: The flood). The evidence stacked against it puts it well outside the same class as aliens.

At least in the case of aliens, you can get incredibly lucky and hit that dime-sized slice of time on the metaphorical building-face. The probability, is scientifically non-zero. Can't really say the same for magical sky-deities, under the current theories. Perhaps if you pray hard enough, they'll send down a fresh book, one that's a touch more modern than the two thousand year old mistranslated versions you're thumping on?

old comment by Jane

I agree with @ -Kelly that God is the fundamental principle of quantum physics by which an electron-positron pair will spontaneously generate in a total vacuum. God is the quantum-dynamic eddy current which will divide the waters and bring into being matter and energy from the void. The same principles are also invoked in cosmological theories on the origin of the universe.
These physical principles seem to be mathematically consistent and empirically provable, albeit not yet complete. The fact is that the mathematical consistency describing the nature of the universe is so compelling as to indicate that Mathematics is itself an attribute of the natural universe. God by this definition seems provable in principle.
God is also the set of meta-complexities, proceeding from and built upon fundamental quantum-dynamics, which eventually brought into being ourselves -- creatures of sentient consciousness.

old comment by familyguyisn't funny

Hmmm most atheist worship apes. I guess, that's your God. How sad is that? I worship Jesus, aka God in the flesh. Not a friggen ape. You atheist religion is a church without Christ. You guys should really read some Flannery O' Connor sometime. She mocks you atheist calling you "GONGA" worshippers. hahahahaha and as Flannery would quote, "You shall know the truth and the truth shall make you odd.”
Yes, CHRISTIANS are odd because we are not of the world and the world hates us.

"One of the tendencies of our age is to use the suffering ot children to discredit the goodness of God, and once you have discredited his goodness, you are done with HIM."

David J. Stewart #fundie jesus-is-savior.com

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