clirus #fundie

clirus #fundie christianforums.com

"Tolerance is allowing for a mistake. Too much tolerance is a mistake. Tolerance is allowing for a mistake, too much tolerance is accepting an habitual mistake (Atheistic Lifestyle of sin).

PS The theme of the Bible is a God of both Love and Righteousness. Too many people that call themselves Christians will only discuss the Love of God. I consider those that will only discuss the concept of a God of Love to be Liberal Christians.

PS - It drives Atheists crazy when you show America was founded as a Christian Nation, even though America did lie to the Muslims in the Treaty of Tripoli."

76 comments

old comment by arctic knight

Article VI paragraph 2, U.S. Constitution:

This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land;

Take not that treaties are part of the "supreme law of the land. That means, lie or not, the fact that the Treaty of Tripoli says we were not founded on Christianity makes that statement law and has all the power of the Constitution behind that law. If you have any regard at all for the US Constitution, you had better get it through your thick skull that, by law, we were not founded as a Christian nation.

old comment by Brendan Rizzo

Ah, clirus. Had she lived one hundred years ago she'd be a thorn in the side of the women's movement, as her sheer stupidity would have been seized upon by chauvinists as proof of the "righteousness" (a.k.a., excuses and lame justifications) of their cause. Does she not know that it is a violation of international law to lie on an official treaty like that? What purpose would it serve, anyway? Any Christian who would lie about their religion for personal gain (as she imagines the Founders would have if they were Christian) would not be a "True Christian" anyway, especially according to these fundies. You can't have it both ways. I would also consider the notion of righteousness being incompatible with love to be a serious mistake, and probably the cause of all the dicatorships in history that weren't headed by a complete and utter psychopath. Theocracies are the greatest proof of this.

old comment by Giveitaday

Tolerance is allowing for a mistake. Too much tolerance is a mistake. Tolerance is allowing for a mistake, too much tolerance is accepting an habitual mistake .

And intolerance is the seed of tyranny.

The theme of the Bible is a God of both Love and Righteousness. Too many people that call themselves Christians will only discuss the Love of God.

And far, far too many people that call themselves Christians define both themselves and their "god" by who and what they hate.

I consider those that will only discuss the concept of a God of Love to be Liberal Christians.

What you consider people to be has no bearin on who or what they actually are. Your opinion is wholly irrelavent.

It drives Atheists crazy when you show America was founded as a Christian Nation

It doesn't bother me a bit because you can't show that, you can assert it all you want too but that will never make it true. If America were intended to be a "christian nation" you'd think that the founding fathers would have spelled that out somewhere in the constitution.

even though America did lie to the Muslims in the Treaty of Tripoli

Do you honestly expect anyone to believe that two US presidents, a handful of diplomats and the entirety of the US senate all conspired together to lie about america's religious orientation? And to the benefit of what? What purpose would lying serve? And on top of all of that, what proof can you offer that a lie was even intended other than your assertion.

Moreover, do you honestly expect people to believe that both the first and second president and many of the other founding fathers who were still serving in the legislature thought so little of the their republic they fought so hard to create that they would intentionally author a fallacious treaty that would be enshrined by the constitution as the law of the land?

old comment by TheJebusFire

Tolerance is allowing for a mistake. Too much tolerance is a mistake. Tolerance is allowing for a mistake, too much tolerance is accepting an habitual mistake

Do you know any other synonyms for "mistake?"

The theme of the Bible is a God of both Love and Righteousness.

No, the biblical god is power hungry maniac who will kill anyone who even slightly disagrees with him.

PS - It drives Atheists crazy when you show America was founded as a Christian Nation, even though America did lie to the Muslims in the Treaty of Tripoli."

Actually, we didn't lie to Tripoli. If America were a Christian Nation, our founding fathers wouldn't have written the freedom of religion part in the first amendment.

old comment by dionysus

@ConservativeCommunist

Nobody's saying that Christianity had absolutely no influence at all on the country and nobody's saying that they don't ever want to hear the word "god" ever again. I'm afraid you're attacking a strawman here. Also, if the line about not being founded as a Christian nation was supposed to be for the sake of the Muslims, why in the hell was it NOT in the Arabic version? That's quite a huge blunder to make, don't you think?

@Tolpuddle Martyr

If you sign a treaty no one gives a shit if you "lied", it's a legal document and you put your name to it!

Exactly. I can't go off and sign a contract with someone then simply say "I was just messing around". Besides, even if it wasn't legally binding if anyone found out I was lying about such a thing then nobody would ever want to negotiate with me again.

old comment by Anon-e-moose

"It drives Atheists crazy when you show America was founded as a Christian Nation"

Only in your imaginations though. 'Drives us Crazy'? That's as nothing compared to the conniptions and aneurysms you fundies have, when we Atheists point out these quotes by their own Founding Fathers:

'Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise, every expanded prospect'

'In no instance have... the churches been guardians of the liberties of the people'

-James Madison

'I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature'

'There is more need for lighthouses in our country than churches.'

'But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.'

(emphasis added):

'Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear'

-Thomas Jefferson

Moral: Tolerance is a door that swings both ways. And on that note: LGBT people. If you don't tolerate them, fundies, what makes you think that you, your 'beliefs' and the unjustifiable bigotry based on such, have the right to be tolerated too?

"PS The theme of the Bible is a God of both Love and Righteousness. Too many people that call themselves Christians will only discuss the Love of God. I consider those that will only discuss the concept of a God of Love to be Liberal Christians."

Free Offer: God's Unconditional* Love!

*- Terms and Conditions apply.

old comment by emau99

It drives Atheists crazy when you show America was founded as a Christian Nation...

That's because it wasn't, and there is ample evidence to that effect.

even though America did lie to the Muslims in the Treaty of Tripoli.

"I know what I know, and anything that doesn't agree with me is a lie!" LOL. Classic fundie dodge.

As others have pointed out, even if the Treaty of Tripoli really was a lie (and there's absolutely no reason to think that it was), it still carries the force of law, per the US Constitution.

Ergo, the US was NOT founded as a Christian Nation.

Not that any of this matters. I'm disagreeing with you, so I must be lying, eh clirus?

clirus #fundie christianforums.com

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