Sue Knight: Would Darwin accept his theory if he came back now?

David Murray: even nuts like ken ham accept that natural selection is glaringly obvious

Sue Knight: Yes, natural selection. But that is a different thing from evolution.
If we evolved,it could be a mechanism of Evolution. But did we? Surely we know so much now about the intricate complexity of even the "simplest" life form not to see the work of a grand Designer?

David Murray: Darwins theory is natural selection, a mechanism of evolution, evolution is about inheriting traits, natural selection is who lives to pass them on, thats evolution, its in grade school level science books.
if you think there is a grand designer worthy of worship, you need to visit some children's wards.

Sue Knight: And David that was always my problem - as a child I was taught that there is a God, and he is all good and all powerful. And yet the world is full of suffering - and nature is "red in tooth and claw with ravine".
And we are all brainwashed with the idea that Genesis is a "creation myth". So it wasn't till many years later that I sat down and read it, and began to understand.

David Murry: Genesis is a myth penned during the Babylonian exile.
It doesnt matter how many god stories people come up with, it has nothing to do with biological evolution.

Sue Knight: Hello David. and yet generation upon generation of faithful Jewish scribes carefully counted the generations down from Adam.
And the first chapter of Genesis ends this way:
"Then God said: “Here I have given to you every seed-bearing plant that is on the entire earth and every tree with seed-bearing fruit. Let them serve as food for you. And to every wild animal of the earth and to every flying creature of the heavens and to everything moving on the earth in which there is life, I have given all green vegetation for food.” And it was so.
After that God saw everything he had made, and look! it was very good..."
It was very good, it was perfect. And,whether you believe this or not, is this describing a Darwinian world, in which nature is "red in tooth and claw", a world full of the hunters and the hunted?
This was a paradise. The whole creation was at peace.Why isn't it now? Genesis does go straight on to explain.

Rayburne Winsor: Natural selection is not proof of goo-to-you evolution. The main objection to "goo-to-you evolution is not about whether changes occur through time, and neither is it about the size of the change (so use of micro or macro-evolution should be discouraged) It isn't even about whether natural selection happens . It does. The key issue is the type of change required to change microbes into men--the kind of change that requires changes that increase the functional genetic information content in the genome. All the alleged "proofs" of "evolution in action" to date do not show functional new information is added to genes. Rather they involve sorting and/or loss of information. Natural selection cannot create anything new; it only selects from what is available. Therefore, demonstrating that natural selection occurs does not prove that goo-to-you evolution occurs. It helps adaption to the environment by removing genes (of the unfit) from the population, but it cannot bring about the information-increasing change necessary for goo-to-you evolution to occur. And if anyone argues it does, he is lying to you. Don't for that crap. Dr. Felix-Konotey--Ahulu, a world authority on sickle cell anemia states: "Demonstrating natural selection does not demonstrate that "upward " evolution is a fact, yet many school children are taught this as "proof" of evolution. He pointed out that the sickle cell gene is still a defect , not an increase in complexity or an improvement in function which is being selected for. And he pointed out the unhappy downside , that "having more carriers of the sickle cell genes results in more people suffering from this terrible disease (Exposing Evolution's Icon: World leader on sickle cell anemia:" Nothing to do with evolution! " Jonathan Sarfati interviews Felic-Konotey-Ahulu, Creation 29 (1):16-19, 2006).

Sue Knight: And Rayburne, Genesis does explain the genetic damage that every one of us carries in various different ways. It tolls us that when our first parents made that fatal decision to cut themselves off from their Creator, their Source of life,they found they could not even keep themselves alive, let alone run this beautiful and complex planet.
We,, their damaged children, are still living with the chaos and suffering that decision caused. Our Creator, Jehovah, the God of Abraham, has let us live with this for a while. Only a few days in his eyes.
But he has not abandoned us to it. What is it we are praying for when we ask for God's Kingdom to come?