Although negative numbers were not accepted by mathematicians until the 1600s, negative infinity is logically implied by the existence of Hell as described frequently in the Gospels. Also, the existence of an infinitely good God implies the existence of an infinitely bad evil that rejects God.
Negative infinity is difficult to define with independent terminology. Taking a cue from negative infinity as a representation of Hell, negative infinity is the lowest value possible.
27 comments
negative infinity
Wouldn't 'positive' infinity and 'negative' infinity compromise only half of infinity each? Together they would be true infinite infinity. This implies that God, which is all, is infinitely evil and infinitely good.
Simple logic, captain.
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Although negative numbers were not accepted by mathematicians until the 1600s
Assuming you're ignoring everything except Europe, that is. Chinese mathematicians were using negative numbers in 200 AD, and they spread to India and then Arabia. OTOH, European mathematicians assumed negative numbers were wrong because they were "absurd".
I thought Hell was conspicuously NOT well described in the Gospels. In one place it's cold, in one it's hot, in another it's simply being away from God. Logic has little or nothing to do with it, in any case.
Isn't God omnipotent? He'd certainly wouldn't allow such a bad evil to exist...
Lowest value possible? Something like the Absolute Zero (-273,15 on the Celsius scale)...?
"Also, the existence of an infinitely good God implies the existence of an infinitely bad evil that rejects God."
The existence of any God, infinitely good or not, has still to be proven.
"Negative infinity is difficult to define with independent terminology"
The past.
Rambling like this about infinity or Omnipotence always sound stupid to us because they are always meandering nonsense that explains nothing. It's the 'confuse your flock' so they don't understand and think your deep or smarter than them.
I think you're really reading too much into the bible. It's bad enough when you shoehorn modern scientific discoveries into your bible, but here you're reading something into it which isn't even there.
And if you read the bible literally, it doesn't talk about a place called Hell, nor is Satan the infinitely evil bad guy.
@ #2049389
Isaiah 45:7 pretty much says that in no uncertain terms, according to the Christians own holy book their god is ultimately responsible for everything that happens in the world both good and bad.
If God is truly all powerful, then he would have to be ultimately responsible for every single tiny thing that happens in the world, good or bad. It comes back to the old question of evil. If God allows bad things to happen, then he can't be all good. If he's powerless to prevent bad things from happening, then he's not all powerful.
Negative infinity logically implies someone as dumb as you should exist somewhere.
@Swede
@Swede
Well, to a group of loons who dedicated themselves to a version of the gospel that literally tolerates no happiness for them and preaches them to do nothing but praise god, hate everyone else, and beg for forgiveness for their sins, since everything else is considered sinning, just the idea of not being with the guy who they screwed their own lives over for would be hell.
Now we know why The FAIL Jimmy Wilcum left Conservapoodia: although he was a sysop there.
Even he couldn't stand these levels of stupidity: which are OVER 9000!
Did you know that - while infinitesimally small, and can only be measured with the most sensitive instruments - flash memory is heavier when there is no data recorded on such, than when it's full. See? Negative numbers work.
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And considering how you helped to pioneer Flash Memory whilst at Intel decades ago, enjoy your paradox, Andy Schaftafly.
A certain Mad Aussie Sparky would weep. It wouldn't surprise me if you're one of the reasons EEVBlog's Dave Jones is a hardcore Atheist.
@Anon-e-moose
" while infinitesimally small, and can only be measured with the most sensitive instruments - flash memory is heavier when there is no data recorded on such, than when it's full. See? Negative numbers work. "
Which are heavier, ones or zeros?
Although negative numbers were not accepted by mathematicians until the 1600s, negative infinity is logically implied by the existence of Hell as described frequently in the Gospels.
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Not only does he believe that negative infinity is a concept first described in the Bible and related to hell, he also believes it's a number. I knew Andy was bad at math, but he's really, really bad at math in a special sort of way.
negative numbers were not accepted by mathematicians until the 1600s
This is only for mathematicians in Europe. Chinese and Indian mathematicians had already been using them before the 1600s.
@checkmate
Wouldn't 'positive' infinity and 'negative' infinity compromise only half of infinity each? Together they would be true infinite infinity.
I know you're probably just joking around but this doesn't make any sense.
@Anon-e-moose
while infinitesimally small
If it had a weight it wouldn't be infinitesimally small.
Here is an answer to that on the physics stack exchange.
It seems it would depend on how the magnetic domains on a disk interact with their neighbors, and each bit is stored as a pair of magnetic domains. Basically, what it comes down to is that something like (a one)
image image
has more potential energy than a configuration like (a zero)
image image
so when you take mass-energy equivalence into account, the top configuration must be more massive.
Note: The bar magnet diagrams don't look right in mobile view.
@dxdydz, Mister Spak
If it had a weight it wouldn't be infinitesimally small
Ask Andy that, and watch his head asplode. >:D
...and perhaps I should have said extremely small. Brain fart there. XP
And would a hole of negative infinite depth then be a column of matter of infinite height?
My diagnosis of Andy remains firm. Mercury poisoning. The only other explanation that comes to mind is late stage syphilis, but that would require .... (shudder).
Negative Infinity is what resides inside Andy Schlafly's cranium.
@Anon-e-moose
"Although negative numbers were not accepted by mathematicians until the 1600s..."
That's European mathematicians twinkie. The Chinese were using negative numbers by 200 BCE and probably long before. The Indians and Muslims were using them in the 7th and 9th centuries respectively.
@Checkmate
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
volume element (aka, dxdydz),
"Not only does he believe that negative infinity is a concept first described in the Bible and related to hell, he also believes it's a number."
Well, when dealing with real numbers infinity (positive or negative) is a concept not a number. However, in the extended real number line, ± infinity are 'numbers'.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_real_number_line
@Night Jaguar
I'm familiar with the extended real numbers but I'm fairly certain this is not what Schafly is referring to.
There are also several other places where infinities act as numbers or (more generalized) arithmetic objects. I'm assuming you're already familiar with cardinal numbers like ℵn which are defined through cardinalities of power sets of the integers. There are also the beth numbers which are similar to the alephs but we have ℷ1 =|R|. These numbers play with each other differently depending on if you take the axiom of choice (taking the axiom of choice is makes the math more colorful imo) and how they interact also depends on how you decide to play with the continuum hypothesis. On top of these there are also the ordinal numbers where things can also get crazy big, crazy fast.
Some other places where infinities as numbers come up are in the complex projective plane and the projective real line. In addition to the complex projective plane there is also a projective version of the 2D Cartesian plane, infinity is especially handy here because the point at infinity ends up being the identity element for elliptic curves.
I'm sure there are more examples that I'm not familiar with too.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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