Imagine that you are looking at a luxury liner moving through calm waters. To your amazement about a dozen people jump off the ship, and cling to a lifeboat. You watch as the rest of the passengers stand on the ship and laugh at them.
You can understand their reaction. What those few people did was foolish. It made no sense. Suddenly, the ship hits an unseen iceberg and sinks, taking with it all who stayed on board. Now you see that those who seemed like fools were wise, but those who stayed on the ship and seemed to be wise, were fools.
We have in the Bible a command to jump off the luxury liner of this world. Before you laugh at stupid Christians, ask yourself if there is any proof that its claims are true. I would suggest that you take the time to read the Gospel of John, with a humble heart.
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"Before you laugh at stupid Christians, ask yourself if there is any proof that its claims are true."
You got any evidence, Bananaboy? Or must we just wait for God's "supernatural transformation"?
Suddenly, the ship hits an unseen iceberg and sinks, taking with it all who stayed on board.
If the iceberg really is unseen, the people have no reason to abandon the ship, meaning no one would actually abandon the ship.
If some people do know an iceberg is coming, it means they have some evidence that lead to that conclusion. It could be a radar scan, it could be being able to look outside the ship and see the iceberg itself, etc. You know, something that can actually be seen and reproduced . Because of that, everyone would want to abandon the ship.
Ray, please, please , stop using these pathetic analogies because they fall apart as soon as someone of healthy mind actually starts thinking about them.
So in your world, very expensive ships carrying as much as 2000 souls on board will have no navigational equipment or lifeboats, sink to the bottom in a matter of seconds, and God will only save those who believe in have by giving them the foresight to jump off before hand, and there would be no inquest as to why those people jumped ship moments before it sank, making no effort to rescue the other passengers.
Yeah, I guess that analogy does work, after all.
So, you are finally going to sell all your possessions and give the money to the poor? Great!
The ones who jumped off the ship will in all likelihood freeze to death.
Ray, there's the luxury structure in Dubai: the Burj Khalifa. Go to the top, and jump off.
Your J-boy didn't have the cojones to do the same, as per the Bible, thus he didn't even have faith in... himself . Even though he could .
About your 'Faith', Banana Man. And that luxury building. Now ask yourself if there is any proof that your J-boy existed ?
For your 'fable' here, as an 'analogy' that is supposed to have any relevance to over a century later - certainly with even small craft having Radar - then I suggest you do just that: travel to Dubai, take a lift to the top of that luxury building, and jump off. If this 'world' is as bad as you say it is. For every second you're not , then you only serve to prove that you are, in fact, more Atheist than we Atheists: you love this world too much to top yourself & accelerate that '(C)Rapture'. Otherwise, your 'God' would prevent you becoming two-dimensional soon after jumping off the Burj Khalifa. But then, you once claimed that 'Gravity didn't exist in space'; the space between the to pof the Burj Khalifa & the ground. And don't you lot - along with Germs - also say that 'Gravity is just a theory '...?!
Tl;dr: 'Radar'. Try again with the 'anal ogies' you keep pulling out of your arse, Ray Cumfart.
"I would suggest that you take the time to read the Gospel of John, with a humble heart."
I would suggest you take the time to read a few hundred papers on global warming. Bananas might become extinct in the heat.
> We have in the Bible a command to jump off the luxury liner of this world.
And go... where, exactly? The Moon?
> Before you laugh at stupid Christians, ask yourself if there is any proof that its claims are true.
Yes, clearly anyone who has ever done that must inevitably come to the conclusion that Christianity is completely right. It can't be that people have done that and dismissed it as completely fake, can it?
As usual, Banana-brain, your analogy is fucked up.
Icebergs actually exist, and have been shown to cause ships to sink.
Your god has never been shown to exist, and has never been shown to cause ships to sink. The only evidence you have is some 2000-year-old book that claims your god exists, and can cause ships to sink. And you're using this ancient book to convince others not only to jump off the ship, but to give you money so you can convince even more people that your god exists, will cause the ship to sink, that they also need to jump off, and if they don't jump off they'll be tortured forever in some horrible place that's never been shown to exist, while all evidence shows the ship is traveling safely through tropical waters.
Oh you mean the gospel that contradicts the other gospels when it comes to the really big stories that you have major holidays based on? That's the one you want us to read to have evidence? You do know that its Easter story has literal zombies in it right?
All I can do is laugh Ray, the metaphor you're looking for ends with the luxury liner making a safe trip all the way to its intended destination without any major disasters.
Even were there an actual iceberg somewhere ahead, idiots like Bananabrain have been jumping off a perfectly good ship for 2,000 years, certain to would sink any second.
Actually I would say that they were monsters for seeing the iceberg coming and rushing to save themselves while allowed everyone else to die. What you and your little example differ on is the nature of the threat. The iceberg was both visible and just ahead. The threat you've been warning us about is invisible has been coming "any day now" for the last 2,000 years.
++"Before you laugh at stupid Christians, ask yourself if there is any proof that its claims are true."
I have. They weren't.
"I would suggest that you take the time to read the Gospel of John, with a humble heart."
Ray, just where exactly do you think most of us lose our faith? It's not in the pages of a science book; it's in the pages of the "good" book. All science and history do is give us solid facts and evidence to compare the bible against.
What does it mean, Ray, to read the Gospel of John with a "humble heart"? Does it mean read it with the preconceived notion that it is absolutely true? Sorry, if you want me to do that, you'll have to convince me that it is true first, then we'll talk. If it means something else, would you suggest reading the holy books of any other religion with that same mentality? Of course you wouldn't.
"the iceberg is probably a hologram, and the fleeing Christians are trying to escape from an imaginary disaster"
Or some time ago, someone on the ship started preaching about "the iceberg ahead."
An iceberg that couldn't be detected by radar or sonar or anything else like that AND was invisible to the eye.
"BUT," the preacher would say, "if you have enough faith in my iceberg-spotting abilities, believe in the iceberg, you'll see it!"
The ones who jumped ship were the ones who made themselves believe in the iceberg and were truly believing the ship was about to strike it. Even though the non-believers insisted they saw no iceberg anywhere.
"Imagine that you are looking at a luxury liner moving through calm waters. To your amazement about a dozen people jump off the ship, and cling to a lifeboat."
Who launched the lifeboat?
So why again would any sane person jump off a perfectly seaworthy ship when there was absolutely no evidence of danger?
Because some crazy idiot like you said there were icebergs which no one could see, and the ship was about to sink? So the reason you want people to leave sanity and reality behind...is because you said so?
Ok, you go first. I'll wait safely aboard the ship until there is some tangible evidence for these ship-threatening icebergs, until there is some tangible evidence that the ship is likely going to sink, and until someone like the captain tells everyone it is necessary to abandon ship.
Okay, I asked myself if there were any proof it's claims were true. Nope--none whatsoever. Then I went further--was there any proof that at least some of its claims were false? Yes, there is--for example, physical evidence (such as the Green River and Lake Tusgetsu varve formations) demonstrates that a catastropic global flood as described in thebible could not occurred in the geoplogically recent past (and by that I mean anytime in the past 20 million years).
I feel a period of extended laughter coming on...
First bananas, then parachutes, now an iceberg? In light of overwhelming evidence, I am forced to conclude that Ray Comfort is an asshead.
Now imagine that some people on another cruise liner suddenly announce that they have a letter from the shipbuilders which said that at some point the ship would hit an iceberg and everyone still on board would die. The letter then says that only those people who line up on the heliport (it's a very posh cruise liner) and shout how much they love shipbuilders will be taken off at the last moment to an even better cruise liner (that is also totally iceberg proof) and receive an endless tropical cruise on the house!
Next imagine that some of these people aren't content with waiting on the heliport and shouting at the coulds, in between bouts of belittling everyone else for going about enjoying this "inferior" cruise and ignoring the danger of icebergs. No, some of these people think that knowing what the shipbuilders said about icebergs makes them eminently more qualified to steer the ship than any of the crew, and moreover they should be actively looking for icebergs to crash into , thereby bringing about the "last moment" - and thus the promised arrival of the helicopters - all that much sooner.
Are these people wise, Ray, or foolish? Or are you too busy begging the sky for a helicopter ride to figure it out?
ask yourself if there is any proof that its claims are true
I have, that's why I'm a Luciferian. And that's the problem: That you are incapable of imagining someone reading the Bible and not coming to the same conclusions you do.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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