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@oxford_karma

I agree totally with you. Moral relativism is ridiculous. There comes a point where you have to draw a line and say somethings are good and somethings are bad. Having sex with 10 year old girls is wrong no matter where you are (I can't believe that I actually have to argue the point). People, keep an open mind, but don't let your brain fall out.

Are you Atheist? Are you rational? On what grounds do you make your moral claims? Intellectually speaking, what's the difference between having sex with someone who is 18, 16, 14, 12 or 10 years old? Why is one 100% morally acceptable while another is 100% morally objectionable? Why is the magic line drawn at 18 and not 16? Why 16 and not 14? Et cetera.

If your basis for moral judgement is zeitgeist, then you've given away the argument.


@oxford_karma

first, I can't believe that I'm being asked to justify my belief that child rape is wrong, but if you really want to do this, I will take the break. Physical: a ten year old is not physically mature enough to sustain a sexual relationship. Duh. Maturity: a ten year old is not emotionally or mentally mature enough to be "married," you dumb-fuck. This includes brain development. Sociologically: a society like this treats women as property, not people. This has a negative effect on human rights (which I guess is too "western" for your silly ass) and promotes victimization and oppession on a wide scale. If that is too abstract for your brain, then we can play this as a consumer problem where market forces are effected by widespread disenfranchisement. Could you imagine her bachelorette party? Fucking barbie themed for age appropriateness. Oh, and I love the "are you atheist" opening. Very self-righteous of you

You completely missed the point of my questions. Anyone can say that X is wrong, but why? In our culture we view marriage to a 10 year old as rape, but in their culture it's normal. Why is our moral perspective superior? Likewise, many in their culture may argue that abortion is murder and to let a murderer keep his life is unjust. Why is our morality superior in this case?

In order to claim our culture's moral values are superior you'd better have a strong, objective standard of morality to measure things by. Morality is either relative or absolute. If it's absolute, how and why? If it's relative, you've already lost the argument for your culture's moral superiority.

People have been giving their sons and daughters in marriage at that age for thousands of years. Any perceived negative consequences that you have are unique to modern Western culture. Your entire concept of marriage is different than theirs. There's a high probability that this girls mother, grandmother, sisters, cousins and female companions all had similar marriages. To them, it's normal. It's just the way things are. You're projecting your own Western values onto them and judging them when you have absolutely no idea what it's like to be born and raised in such a culture.

@cool_drank

Do you think a 10 year old has the same mental capacity as an 18 year old? What does being an atheist have to do with moral claims?

If you're religious then your basis for moral claims is religious belief. If you're a rational atheist then you have to be able to support your claims with reason.

So why is a 18 year old suddenly capable of a healthy marital relationship when a 16/14/12/10 year old isn't? What is an acceptable age to you? Where do you draw the line? Given our society's rampant divorce and generally screwed up relationships, what exactly are the mental requirements of a healthy marital relationship? What makes you think our culture has it right? Given that their culture has been doing this for thousands of years, where is the evidence proving your position?

@cool_drank

If you're religious then your basis for moral claims is religious belief. If you're a rational atheist then you have to be able to support your claims with reason.

So why is a 18 year old suddenly capable of a healthy marital relationship when a 16/14/12/10 year old isn't? What is an acceptable age to you? Where do you draw the line? Given our society's rampant divorce and generally screwed up relationships, what exactly are the mental requirements of a healthy marital relationship? What makes you think our culture has it right? Given that their culture has been doing this for thousands of years, where is the evidence proving your position?


Your reaction is a purely emotional one. I'm just illustrating the hypocrisy in taking a moral stance on this issue without being able to back it up.

Morality is either absolute or relative. If it's relative, then you have no argument. If it's absolute, then you need to explain how and why. Religious people claim morality is absolute and back it up with a "higher power" or some other foundational principle. I'm trying to get you to explain what foundational principle your "absolute morality" is based on.

Also, you still haven't answered any of my questions. At what age does this introduction to "rational thought" occur?

In Jewish culture going back thousands of years, you were an adult when you reached the age of 12, and betrothals and marriages at this age weren't unusual. Up to nearly a hundred years ago, most Western countries set the age of consent between 10-13 years old. In modern Spain the age of consent is 13. In several countries in Europe and most of South America sets the age of consent at 14. In several countries, including North Korea set it at 15. The most common age of consent for most countries is 16. In the USA it varies between 16 and 18 depending on the state. Some countries set the age of consent at puberty instead of a specific age.

Which countries would you accuse of supporting pedophilia? Why are your moral values superior to that of millions, if not billions, of people around the world? I'm just looking for you to provide some underlying foundational principle for your (rather bold) position that doesn't depend on feigning shock and painting me (or anyone else) as a pedophile supporter.

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