[What to do if you're trapped in an evolution class]
There are some creationists who advise students to counter with “were you there?” but this is a bad idea. For one thing AiG (per above) does not practice this strategy with persons they are interested in attaining. They kept Jason Lisle’s beliefs a secret, publishing articles by him under a pseudonym until after he completed his degree.
Also, the fourth grade teacher knows the fifth and sixth grade teachers. If a young student (rebelliously?) challenges his or her teacher with “Were you there?” it could easily be answered: “No, and neither were you. So quiet down and listen to what the experts teach us.” Is it a good thing for Christian students to get bad science grades when they may actually be good at science? If the fourth, fifth, and sixth grade teachers decide to reward the “fittest” and to punish the “less fit” to survive, then a student who asks, “Were you there?” may never want to learn about real science in the future.
34 comments
What to do if you're trapped in an evolution class:
Sit down, shut up, and at least learn what the hell you're hating so much actually IS.
But it's only the Christians who have to learn what other people say in order to get good grades, of course.
All the other children get straight A's for making stuff up and submitting 'original research'!
Erm, no.
If a Christian wants to challenge evolution, wait until postgraduate level at least. Until then, sit down and learn like everyone else.
Actually a lot of Christian students get great science grades. They would look at you with your "creationist nonsense" and say "Were you there? NO? Then shut up and get out of my classroom and let my SCIENCE TEACHER teach me SCIENCE, I go to my CHURCH to learn RELIGION"!!! Unfortunately they would be much smarter than you. CSErs are NOT "Smarter than a Fifth-grader", if they were they would not be following a false prophet caught stealing in the name of the Lord.
"Is it a good thing for Christian students to get bad science grades when they may actually be good at science? If the fourth, fifth, and sixth grade teachers decide to reward the “fittest” and to punish the “less fit” to survive, then a student who asks, “Were you there?” may never want to learn about real science in the future."
But if they were any good at science they wouldn't be christians in the first place.
In this case, survival of the fittest means, suck up, fake believing in evolution, and keep your mouth shut.
Tastes like conformity.
At least they encourage the readers to stop disturbing the classes...
cyborgtroy:
No it doesn't. It means learning what they claim evolution is about. You can read the bible and know it word for word without pretending to be a christian, the same works with textbooks.
Understanding the material=/=believing it. Your grades are determined more or less by how well you understand it, not whether or not you believe in it. The classroom is not a debate area because they WANT to get through it quickly.
Anyways, what Fundies don't seem to grasp is this: If you actually understood what you were arguing against, you'd get a lot more respect & credibility from the non-believers. People like you are the problem. You sit back & go "Lies lies lies lies" in your head, & then you expect the theory you fabricated with bits & pieces of what you actually heard to make sense.
Ugh, nothing frusturates me more than a "Evolution is bullshit, so hear no evil," Fundie. 'Cept maybe the more extreme "Science is bullshit, so hear no evil," Fundie.
Hang on. This guy is arguing AGAINST the use of the "Were you there?" argument by YECs.
That's a good thing, right? This quote shouldn't be here.
@Dan - yes, but then he goes on to state that teachers might decide to reward the "fittest" and punish the "less fit" (meaning the creationists) by giving them bad grades, once again demonstrating his complete lack of understanding.
I worry more about the abuse the child of a fundamentalist will suffer at the hands of his or her parents if they actually start to understand evolution, and other aspects of science, and takes this knowledge home only to have a Bible shoved down his or her throat.
@RichardT
Forgive me, but if you're going to challenge accepted scientific theorem, you should come to the table with more than a book of mythology. The accounts of Genesis are just as valid as claims of Norse Mythology, or Greek, or Hindu. So we either go with what we have evidence of, or we give everything air time. If you choose not to believe evolutionary theory, by all means don't. If you don't want your children to, teach them about Genesis at church, or at home. Do not expect everyone to believe the same, though.
"For one thing AiG (per above) does not practice this strategy with persons they are interested in attaining "
Wow. That is some pretty sinister evangelism. But I wonder: Once somebody has been "attained" by Answers in Genesis, do they count as a resource of the website itself, or do they become the property of whoever owns it. In the case of the latter, does anything have to be signed in blood beforehand?
"These are the kinds of thoughts that kept me out of the really good schools."
I took it as 'just shut up with your stupid baseless arguments and try to learn something'.
If you've been reading Abramson's comments, you know that he meant "don't let on that you're a creationist so you don't get punished by the evil evolutionist conspiracy prematurely."
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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