Obergefell is a State issue. It is NOT a federal issue. If the State legislature agrees with the ruling, then they can make it a state law. Until then, it is ONLY an opinion.
KNOW the law!!!
32 comments
You mentioned Marbury v Madison the other day and drew from it a principle of law. But Marbury v Madison is "ONLY" an opinion. But tell me this, afchief: if what you say is true, then why, for the last 200-odd years, have the legislative and executive branches acted as if the Supreme Court's opinion was the final decision "both as to Law and Fact" (United States Constitution, Article 3)?
Equal civil rights is not a state issue, but a universal issue.
I'm Swedish, and have never studied American law, but I still know (thanks to people’s obstinate refusal* to accept the SCOTUS ruling in Obergefell) that the judges on the Supreme Court writes a statement after a ruling (a kind of summary, I guess), which is called "Opinion". That one is not the ruling itself, just the summary.
* Side note: what's their PROBLEM?!? No-one is going to force them to marry someone of their gender, but people like them have been forcing gay people to marry someone of the opposite gender, for centuries.
I agree with Swede: "Equal civil rights is not a state issue, but a universal issue." Granted, the Declaration of Independence is not the Constitution, but it does say that we believe that all men are created equal. We decided to become a country based on the unheard-of idea that everyone on the planet was created equal, and we would conduct ourselves as such. Sometimes these wingnuts seem to forget that there are others in this world besides those who live in 'Murrica
Afchief, who else, floundering along in "Law-as-I-wish-it-to-be". Afchief and I have opinions, but SCOTUS has capital-O Opinions. Whole 'nother thing. Yes, I know, it's confusing, dear, but the fact that a word has more than one definition in the dictionary doesn't mean that you get to apply whichever definition you want and pretend it suits the context. This is on a par with the creationists whining "but evolution is only a theory!"
No it is fucking not.
The Constitution establishes the Supreme Court as THE ruling body and final word for all laws and treaties in the US. Other courts are explicitly called inferior and "supreme" isn't in the name for marketing reasons. A ruling made in any court of law is not an opinion it is legally binding until overturned and the Supreme Court holds the power to overturn any lesser court or put an immediate end to a proposed law if it were to be challenged as unconstitutional which is exactly what happened. You bring up sodomy laws and ask in a dim-witted self-important tone why it took the Supreme Court so long to shut them down if that was their job but refuse to take into account that A) nobody cared enough at the time to challenge it constitutionally and likely wouldn't have ruled impartially and more importantly B) if you're so infuriatingly certain SCOTUS rulings are just "opinions" then why were States that were and still are opposed to homosexuals having any rights under the law whatsoever forced to comply?
You are talking shit, buddy, and people who know better including those who actually work in the legal system have been correcting you from day one but you act like you know better than the Founding Fathers when you can't smell the shit on your knees or your breath.
Seeing as how judicial review was a standard government power which Hamilton wrote about in the Federalist, a series of tracts written to promote the Constitution, that leaves this guy in a tight spot.
afchuff : The RL Don Quixote tilting at the windmills that are the SCOTUS.
...and yes, I know the Law. His name is Judge Joseph Dredd. [/"2000 AD"]
<KNOW the law!!!>
Oh dear. That was a lovely Irony Meter factory we used to have there...
I'm sure the massive, smoking crater that's there now will make for a lovely tourist attraction though.
Like a broken record, this one is. Cracked, and repetitious. To quote my Great Aunt's generation, "PUT A SOCK IN IT!"
@ Swede
An opinion is usually a statement of the facts of the case as the judge finds them. So, as well as a summarizing the case, the judge rules on any disputes of fact between the parties. The opinion also gives the judge's reasoning in law why he (or she) ruled the way he (or she) did, examining the case against the relevant legislation and precedents. If cases are appealed to the Supreme Court, this is done on a question of law rather than fact, so a Supreme Court opinion gives the reasons in law why the Supreme Court Justices found one way or the other. It is this statement that informs the legislative and executive branches of government that, for example, same-sex marriage is constitutional, and therefore what it should do about it (in this case, issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples and change state laws and constitutions).
“Obergefell is a State issue.”
“It is NOT a federal issue."
“If the State legislature agrees with the ruling, then they can make it a state law.”
“Until then, it is ONLY an opinion.”
“KNOW the law!!!”
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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