[Dave's "proof" that all carnivores were originally herbivores before the fall]
We have four cats who used to be outdoor cats, and who used to be extremely adept hunters, eating snakes, lizards, birds, small rabbits, voles, mice, etc. A couple of years ago we converted them over to indoor cats where they were getting only bagged cat food. We discovered quite by accident that being indoors all the time they weren't having their need for greens met. See, they could munch on grass when they were outside, but they now rely on us to give them their grass ration every morning. If we don't they definitely make it known to us. They crave the stuff.
Because of this, we discovered that our dog, who is mostly an inside dog, really likes getting lettuce, broccoli, carrots, potatoes, etc., and only eats her bagged dog food after she's gleaned what she can from my son's plate (ahem).
There is no way you could convince me that our dog and our cats couldn't live on a balanced vegetarian diet. Yahoo! The Bible is right again. No surprise there.
49 comments
There is no way you could convince me that our dog and our cats couldn't live on a balanced vegetarian diet.
It says in the Bible that dogs and cats don't need meat to survive? What chapter and verse?
Yes and chickens and other birds eat stones to help grind up their food in their gizzard. (an evolutionary trait they carried over from their ancestors, the dinosaurs.)
There is no way you could convince me that our dog and our cats couldn't live on a balanced vegetarian diet. The Bible is right again. No surprise there.
lol
Pets are like babies. They eat all kinds of weird crap. Hell, my neighbor's dog will eat actual crap, as in poop, if you let it.love .
Dogs are all out omniverous, and capable of surviving a few months on a diet mostly consisting of plant matter.
It says in the Bible that dogs and cats don't need meat to survive? What chapter and verse?
One CAN raise dogs on carefully balanced vegetarian diets, just as humans can do well on such diets, and, in the wild dogs do eat SOME vegetation, but this does not mean that left to their own devices dogs would or could live on the vegetation they collected on their own in the wild.
This "experiment" is atrocious -- too small a data set, no controls, no set parameters, and no clear monitoring, with wildly unsupported conclusions.
"Hell, my neighbor's dog will eat actual crap, as in poop, if you let it."
Is that why God allowed carnivores to live for hundreds and hundreds of generations surviving on meat, then?
Fundies proving that they shouldn't have children OR pets. If you people want to muck up your own bodies adhering to some imagined, bible-ordained menu, then go ahead. The body needs thousands of differnt nutrients, vitamins etc. to function properly, and you are most likely lacking in them as you are in reality, but that's your ass. The minute you begin mucking up the lives of humans and animals that depend on you, you are guilty of abuse.
I'm missing the whole point of Dave's argument. Who said there was no death before Adam's fall? There might be some good Biblical argument that Adam and Eve were immortal, but I don't remember anything about any other living creatures one way or the other. Genesis doesn't address the issue. Romans says "death spread to all men ".
Besides comparing everyone who doesn't agree with them to Nazis, a fundy's favorite quote has to be "There is no way you could convince me that..."
John:
The link appears to be broken ...
"Who said there was no death before Adam's fall? "
Fundies need to claim it's true because if death existed before sin existed, then there is no connection between sin and death. In fundamentalist theology, sin=death, as in "the wages of sin is death." Christ's resurrection is death conquered, and therefore is sin conquered. But if there is no connection between sin and death, then conquering death does not conquer sin, and therefore the resurrection becomes meaningless... whether you sin or not, you still die.
Now, it's useless to point out to fundies that we all die anyway, because they will counter that with the distinction between "bodily death" and "spiritual death"... all bodies die but not all spirits die, and if you live in the resurrected Christ your spirit lives forever. (Yes, it really does kinda devolve into wishing for immortality.) Of course, if that is the case, then why is it so important to believe that physical, bodily death did not exist before the fall? If there is such a distinction, then the fundie should be arguing that spiritual death did not exist before the fall, and that physical death is irrelevant (and this is perfectly tenable theological view). But of course, then you run into the problem of the resurrection itself - was it physical or purely spiritual? Because if it was a bodily resurrection, what's the significance of that if bodily death and spiritual death are not connected? And if spiritual resurrection, how can God spiritually die?
But don't try this on a fundie near you. You'll either be dragged into an argument that ends with the fundie declaring you "unsaveable" or the response will be "I don't know, but I have faith that God is always right."
Female mosquitoes obviously drank nectar and plant juices like their male counterparts before the fall. (in a twisted way that does reflect the best working evolutionary model)
@Emily
Cats will eat some vegetation as a digestive aid-in the wild they would normally eat the whole animal, including stomach contents. They would live on grass alone about as well as you and I would live on Metamucil alone.
Yahweh -
We have four cats who used to be outdoor cats, and who used to be extremely adept hunters, eating snakes, lizards, birds, small rabbits, voles, mice, etc. A couple of years ago we converted them over to indoor cats where they were getting only bagged cat food. We discovered quite by accident that being indoors all the time they weren't having their need for greens met. See, they could munch on grass when they were outside, but they now rely on us to give them their grass ration every morning. If we don't they definitely make it known to us. They crave the stuff greens met.
To the best of my knowledge, cats eat grass to help with digestion, and these cats need a ration of it every day now that their diet is restricted to processed, bagged cat food. The last part - "they crave the stuff" - is really sad. I wonder what advice a vet would give.
He hasn't proved anything. They still apparently eat their bagged food. Meat, as well as other food, is a collection of things which we can theoretically break down and put the necessities in a new form. The reason we say some animals are carnivores in nature is because in the wild meat is the only way they may have access to things they need to live.
If your dogs are eating grass every day, you might want to consult a vet.
Actually, cats NEED to eat meat; they're obligate carnivores. As they can't produce taurine on their own, they need meat it order to supply it - otherwise, they go blind and die. It is still sometimes known for cats and other pets to eat grass, though it has little nutritional value.
(thanks, Wikipedia!)
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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