Modern American liberalism, Mussolini's Fascism, and Hitler's Nazism all have their roots in Wilsonian Progressivism.
49 comments
Umm, except you are wrong on all counts.
On the plus side, we rarely get treated to so much FAIL in one sentence. So, thanks for that!
The Baptists, the Jehovah's Witnesses, the Branch Davidians, and the People's Temple (Jonestown) all have their roots in Protestant Christianity.
(Hey, as long as it's "Guilt by Association" Day....)
I do not know who this Wilson is, nor what his progressivism entails, if anything. I don't profess to be a historian. Or even particularly educated in the subject. But I find it hard to believe that two utterly different - mutually exclusive - political standpoints can have a root in the same philosophy.
How... how can that work?
@#1097123
Wilson was president of the United States during World War I. Varying political standpoints can come out of the same philosophy (ex. the many American political viewpoints having their roots in the revolutionary philosophies of the 18th century).
This fundie, however, fails history on so many levels.
There is a degree of ideological overlap between Wilson's progressivism and Mussolini's fascism, but then there's no doubt a similar degree of overlap with all subsequent US administrations too (a fact conveniently overlooked by Neutralized-Texan and Goldberg).
So they've doubly cherry-picked the data to fit the argument. First choose only those factors that are common, then only point out the commonality for Democrat presidents.
Which is about as convincing as claiming liberals are fascist because Obama, Clinton, JFK, Wilson, Hitler and Mussolini all breathed air.
Well according to King of the Hill, a Naturalized Texan will never be a "True Texan(TM)" no matter how much he tries and sound like an idiot.
As for his comment.
image
I'm not sure why all the American right-wingers seem to hate "fascism" so much. Consider what fascism entailed:
--Religious-based social conservatism as an identifying feature of the "real" citizens of the nation
--Violent anti-socialism
--Emphasis on rural lifestyles as a source of patriotic "authenticity"
--State action to suppress labor unions, minority-advancement groups, unorthodox religious and political ideas, etc.
--Valorization of "tradition" (esp. in gender roles), hierarchy and authority (framed in terms of "leadership" and "loyalty")
--Blaming the poor for their own suffering, except for the social-conservative religious-traditionalist rural-aligned poor, who are poor because of all the evil unpatriotic urban classes
--Alignment of the interests of the state with those of industry
--Framing of the nation as "under assault" by "outside forces" and "enemies within", threats which can only be addressed by overwhelming military force
--Civil rights as objectionable because they conflict with "security" concerns; "we" must be protected from "them", so anyone who challenges "security" measures must be one of "them".
I'm not sure which of these the GOP or the Teabaggers or the FreeCs actually oppose. I think they just don't like the negative connotations now attached to what their political programme was called the last time around.
Hitlers Nazism outlawed abortion prohibited teaching evolution put homos in prison and encouraged owning and shooting lots of guns.
Which party wants to prohibit abortion, outlaw the teaching of evolution, put homos in prison and own and shoot lots of guns?
Yes I know your little fundie brain is overheating but keep trying. You'll get it eventually.
Naturalized what?
Oh, I see. Read the tattoos!
No thanks. Just seeing them and the shaved head tell me all I nee to know.
this just popped into my head:
GRIM REAPER: Take you away. That is my purpose. I am death.
GEOFFREY: Well, that's cast rather a gloom over the evening, hasn't it?
HOWARD: I don't see it that way, Geoff. [sniff] Let me tell you what I think we're dealing with here: a potentially positive learning experience to get an--
GRIM REAPER: Shut up! Shut up, you American. You always talk, you Americans. You talk and you talk and say 'let me tell you something' and 'I just wanna say this'. Well, you're dead now, so shut up!
- monty python, meaning of life.
why? because for some reason us americans feel that we must say something, even if it is stupid, pointless and wrong.
we have to talk no matter what, and it makes me headdesk over my own country.
That would be a lie. The birth of European fascism predated Wilson's arrival on the world scene. And Modern American "liberalism" still owes more to the Gospels than any other source.
In fact, fascism is almost entirely based on rabid nationalism and a sense of entitlement born of racial and social bigotry. It is exclusionary to the point of paranoia in all its forms. That's the exact opposite of the "liberalism" in any given time and place.
Face it you silly Freepers. The right-wing owns fascism. Always has and always will. It is, in fact, the inevitable outcome of right-wing extremism. How could I put it in terms that even a stupid Freeper would understand?
How about: Jesus was the prototypical liberal and no amount of lying will change that. Conversely, fascism is exactly what American "conservatives" have advanced since, at least, the 1950's.
Because progress has only led to terrible things like modern medicine, education that's available to all classes, the acceptance of other races, and actual democracies that allow everyone to vote regardless of gender, wealth or ancestry.
This is made all the more ridiculous because Wilson's ideological inclinations, particularly in international relations, were largely discredited BECAUSE of the rise of fascism and nazism during the second world war.
Arguments like that of Naturalized-Texan are pretty common, but usually based on some rather biased thinking.
First, ideologies rarely have a single source, or even a few sources. Instead, they grow out of, and are products of, their time adn the issues society faces at that point. For example, Socialism grown out of the Industrialization and the conditions of the urban working class. Second, in reality ideologies can overlap, and it can be difficult to determine where a particular thinker is ideologically.
These things are usually brushed over by those who have a clear agenda to smear the other side. While you might find parallells between, say, Liberal and Fascist thinkers, there are also substantial differences. Are those also given the time they deserve? If not, you might end up saying that a wooden table and a wooden ship is the same thing because they're both made of wood.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
To post a comment, you'll need to Sign in or Register . Making an account also allows you to claim credit for submitting quotes, and to vote on quotes and comments. You don't even need to give us your email address.