(CNN) -- A Maryland woman involved with a group described as a religious cult pleaded guilty in the starvation death of her son, but insisted that the charges be dropped when he is resurrected.
The condition was made a part of Ria Ramkissoon's plea agreement, officials said. She entered the plea Monday in Baltimore, Maryland, to a first-degree felony count of child abuse resulting in death, her attorney, Steven Silverman, said Tuesday.
Ramkissoon, a member of a group called One Mind Ministries, believes Javon Thompson, her year-old son, will rise again, and as part of her plea agreement, authorities agreed to the clause.
130 comments
I don't think it's fundie.
Sad none the less.
Edit:
#932540
Doctor Whom
She's gone way beyond fundie.
Seems only fair.
Good grief.
"pleaded guilty in the starvation death of her son, but insisted that the charges be dropped when he is resurrected. "
I'm going to hell for laughing at that.
I do love how they agreed to drop the charges when he comes back to life.
*headpat* Of course, dear. Whatever you like.
"I think that's fair. Once she proves her son has been resurrected, we can drop the charges."
Yes, and she can't claim that her son has been reincarnated in the form of some other child. (Probably too Buddhist for her tastes, anyway."
I, for one, am disappointed. They may have done it to get the plea accepted, but it still lends legitimacy to their kooky belief. In accepting her terms, they have tacitly accepted that ressurection is possible.
Why doesn't her lawyer just enter an insanity plea? Not that I sympathise with her, but she's clearly got a few wires loose.
EDIT: Sorry, DayGlow got there first.
I'm fairly new and not sure how to post new quotes, but this new site is a gold mine. It's http://www.thefoxnation.com/
The posts under "culture" seem to bring out the really fundie types.
A Maryland woman involved with a group described as a religious cult pleaded guilty in the starvation death of her son, but insisted that the charges be dropped when he is resurrected.
I highly disagree with this "Ressurection Clause". Not only does it lend unwarranted legal support to the idea of ressurection, but it can possibly lead to other deaths as cult members or other hyper religious mental cases see this claus as justification for killing or causing the death of a child since they fully believe (Wrongly) that a ressurection will follow, so they are not in any way deterred by the threat of incarceration or the death penalty because they think they have a "get out of jail free" card. Now of course they don't, but no amount of time in jail can undo the crime, and a child has still needlessly lost it's life. While the clause is silly on it's face, I think it could also lead to more deaths by idiots who take it just a bit too seriously or see it as valid.
After reading the entire article, I feel sad for the mother. The leader on the other hand is completely nuts. In a way, this little bit of the article here is quote-mined. Part of the plea agreement is she must also undergo deprogramming and psychiatric counseling.
I would suggest that people read the article and get the whole picture.
I don't know which is worse, her (other than the murder of the child) her making the plea bargain or the fact that the authorities agreed to her plea bargain.
@LexKitten, I see where you're coming from but I can't feel sorry for her, a mother's love for her child is supposedly the strongest force in the universe. You can't pin the blame on the cult leader, it's her kid, it's her responsibility.
I gotta say, I'd tell her ok. If the kid resurrects then sure.
I wonder how many years she'll wait before she realizes how horrible she is.
I'm with Giveitaday. The first thing I thought was "oh fuck, her fundie friends will see this as a victory."
It doesn't matter that the child won't be resurrected - the raptards will never see the Rapture, but they still wait for it - because they'll never admit that this was an evil, batshit thing to do. "Even the authorities agreed that she can only be charged until Javon resurrects! Aaaany day now, wait and see!"
I'd rather they'd tossed the plea out and gone for the throat. Nobody could possibly say the prosecution wouldn't be successful one way or another.
The impact it has on fellow homocidal fundies might be negligible, but it's a 'might' that I'm not very happy with. Giveitaday explained that bit better than me, though.
I think it was mentioned before, but just take the bitch out back and put a bullet through her skull, with the promise she'd be resurrected immediately after Javon.
The cult leader? Kill her slowly.
@Giveitaday, Caretaker: Nothing could convince folks this crazy that their delusion is incorrect. And they certainly aren't looking to the legal system for confirmation. They're certain they're right in this, and, barring intense psychiatric treatment, they will never believe otherwise. Might as well save the taxpayers the expense of an open/shut trial.
"...agreed to the clause." gold.
sure lady, if he get's back up, you get off.
"Ramkissoon and the others are accused of denying Javon food after the group's leader, a 40-year-old woman who goes by the name Queen Antoinette, decreed the boy was a demon since he refused to say "amen" after meals,"
Imagine what would have happened if the boy had done something seriously wrong.
Sarcasm aside, I'd say this Queen Antoinette should be the one to suffer the worst sentence.
If the boy did happen to resurrect (err, for the sake of argument), I should think having the supposedly deceased victim turn up alive and well is probably enough to get any conviction quashed on it's own. Was there any need for a special clause?
On principle the state should have no truck with this sort of lunacy. The question of whether the child will arise again is a religious, not a secular one. Therefore it is of no concern to the state under the First Amerndment, surely?
Glad the board is back... Thought it was gone forever! Thanks for having it resurrected. :-)
Her faith either is very strong, or she is very desperate. After all, according to the article, her kid is dead since 12/2006, without having showed any tendencies to raise from the dead during the whole time.
It is sick, of course, to allow your cult leader to let your kid starve to death, but I have to admit that her faith in his resurrection, after being dead for 2.5 years, is somehow amusing
I'm not so sure I like the idea of prosecutors fueling her delusions. I'd like to see them starve the bitch like she did her child. And she shouldn't be "comforted" by the thought that her child is going to return... she she be confronted with the tragic and horrifying reality that she murdered her own child, and now she is going to pay, and pay hard for it.
I saw a few people ask why the defense lawyer didn't enter an insanity plea. The reason would be that the defendant would have to agree with the lawyers recommendation (if he's worth his salt I bet you he recommended she plead insanity). Fundies are under the impression that they are totally sane. So they'll never agree to insanity pleas. The only way you get insanity plea without client agreement is if they are too mentally unstable (evaluated by doctors) to appear in court safely.
Also given the immense clogging of the American courts it is a greater victory for the prosecution to give up the "opportunity" to get her for more to keep the case from dragging into a lengthy trial.
So some of you are concerned about the message it sends or the precedent it sets? Well to be honest the clause is meaningless, as stated earlier if the victim of a murder/manslaughter were to resurrect and start walking around just fine then the accused would be either:
A: Set free immediately anyway as murder charges are always overturned when the victim turns up alive (it has happened, people disappear for perfectly mundane reasons and someone gets blamed).
OR B: The person is taken out of prison and re-tried (double jeopardy doesn't apply because it's a different charge) for assault/ battery/negligence/attempted murder/etc
If you read the article you can see that it's almost being treated as an insanity plea because the woman is getting psychiatric help as part of the sentence.
I wouldn't have allowed this plea It seem like a way to avoid responsibility .
Now she gets to go to prison with out take or responsibility or admitting to any real wrong doing .
And it also lets the court to reinforce her delusion that she didn't do anything wrong and it all big misunderstanding and god will make it all better. Evne the court agree that god can make all better.
No this plea was bed idea.The victim wasn't heard here.The court has allowed her to think or believe that he just under six feet of dirt and rock and he's not dead , he is in state of flux and god can fix it .
The woman, and the cult leader, should receive a very grave sentense! Starving her defenceless baby to death, that is almost post-natal abortion.
This is one of the saddest things I've ever heard. Hey, Ria!! The only reason they agreed to your little 'condition' is because they know it's NEVER going to happen! So you get to have a nice long stay in the prison to think about what you did and maybe reevaluate your stance on religion!! Reading stuff like this almost makes me physically sick!! Any parent who starves their child to death is beyond any hope, in my opinion.
As part of her plea bargain, and if she stands any chance of parole, she should be legally forced to recant her 'faith' in that cult (and any other religion), acknowledge that what Atheists say is right all along, and accept that Evolution and the Big Bang are the REAL reasons for the formation of this universe, this planet & all the life on it. Whilst sworn on copies of 'On the Origin of Species', 'A Brief History of Time' and 'The God Delusion'.
...and if she deviates from this, even when freed, then she'll be back in the slammer so fast her feet won't bloody touch. And she'll only leave jail in a box.
This should apply to ALL crimes based on any religious beliefs. NO EXCEPTIONS.
There are degrees of fundiness.
On the scale of 1 to 10 (1 being least fundie), most people are near one.
This one... this one breaks the scale.
It breaks the scale so much that you don't see the scale, but a floating marker in mid-air that is still accelerating upward.
"Ramkissoon, a member of a group called One Mind Ministries, believes Javon Thompson, her year-old son, will rise again, and as part of her plea agreement, authorities agreed to the clause. "
I really, REALLY hope authorities were just humoring her when they agreed to this.
Oooh, there's a nice plot for a "Law and Order" episode.
Meantime, a very very long stretch in the slammer awaits, and well deserved it is too. Bitch.
"Ramkissoon, a member of a group called One Mind Ministries, believes Javon Thompson, her year-old son, will rise again, and as part of her plea agreement, authorities agreed to the clause."
Enjoy your wait then Ria. Hope you like prison food, because the only way you'll have anything different is when you make like a pizza in Soviet Russia: it delivers you in a box.
Wormfoodsville. Population: you .
Not fundie. It's a case of psychosis. And before someone says that's the same with fundies, it's not. Mental illness and fundementalist may have a lot in common, but that's just taking a jab. This is a sad tale :(
Me: "Bitch seat to hell, please."
Satan: "What happened this time?"
Me: "I laughed my ass off about the murder of a child."
Satan: "Wow, that's pretty evil."
Me: "His murderer convinced the court to agree to drop charges *when* he is resurrected."
Satan: "... You get the window seat."
I always like to quote Judge Benjamin Lerner when it comes to fatal faith healings:
"You’ve killed two of your children
not God, not your church, not religious devotion you".
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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